Texas Law on Using Substandard Degrees

[Old Guy]

Xenophobia? I suspect Oxford and Cambridge are not accredited. I know the 30 - 40,000 student university I attended was not accredited. It was a state university outside the US. Most countries would not understand why accreditation would be needed when the state itself runs a school.

[sanantone]

Xenophobia?  I suspect Oxford and Cambridge are not accredited.  I know the 30 - 40,000 student university I attended was not accredited.  It was a state university outside the US.  Most countries would not understand why accreditation would be needed when the state itself runs a school.

I'm sure that Oxford and Cambridge master's degrees would be evaluated as being the equivalent of an accredited master's degree from the U.S. since Oxford and Cambridge are authorized by their governments to issue degrees. 

With a school like ENEB, there might be an issue since they are not authorized to award degrees, and Isabel I won't issue transcripts. You can try all the credential evaluation services to see which one will evaluate the degree as an accredited master's degree.

[Kab]

Xenophobia?  I suspect Oxford and Cambridge are not accredited.  I know the 30 - 40,000 student university I attended was not accredited.  It was a state university outside the US.  Most countries would not understand why accreditation would be needed when the state itself runs a school.

I'm sure that Oxford and Cambridge master's degrees would be evaluated as being the equivalent of an accredited master's degree from the U.S. since Oxford and Cambridge are authorized by their governments to issue degrees. 

With a school like ENEB, there might be an issue since they are not authorized to award degrees, and Isabel I won't issue transcripts. You can try all the credential evaluation services to see which one will evaluate the degree as an accredited master's degree.

Sanantone I get lost with you logic. Please help me out.

Which part of the Spanish law, under which they operate, does not permit them to award "titulos propios" or associate with a University to recognize the content. I'm lost.

[sanantone]

Xenophobia?  I suspect Oxford and Cambridge are not accredited.  I know the 30 - 40,000 student university I attended was not accredited.  It was a state university outside the US.  Most countries would not understand why accreditation would be needed when the state itself runs a school.

I'm sure that Oxford and Cambridge master's degrees would be evaluated as being the equivalent of an accredited master's degree from the U.S. since Oxford and Cambridge are authorized by their governments to issue degrees. 

With a school like ENEB, there might be an issue since they are not authorized to award degrees, and Isabel I won't issue transcripts. You can try all the credential evaluation services to see which one will evaluate the degree as an accredited master's degree.

Sanantone I get lost with you logic. Please help me out.

Which part of the Spanish law, under which they operate, does not permit them to award "titulos propios" or associate with a University to recognize the content. I'm lost.

If they were authorized to award degrees, they wouldn't have to issue them through Isabel I.

[Kal Di]

Xenophobia?  I suspect Oxford and Cambridge are not accredited.  I know the 30 - 40,000 student university I attended was not accredited.  It was a state university outside the US.  Most countries would not understand why accreditation would be needed when the state itself runs a school.

I'm sure that Oxford and Cambridge master's degrees would be evaluated as being the equivalent of an accredited master's degree from the U.S. since Oxford and Cambridge are authorized by their governments to issue degrees. 

With a school like ENEB, there might be an issue since they are not authorized to award degrees, and Isabel I won't issue transcripts. You can try all the credential evaluation services to see which one will evaluate the degree as an accredited master's degree.

Sanantone I get lost with you logic. Please help me out.

Which part of the Spanish law, under which they operate, does not permit them to award "titulos propios" or associate with a University to recognize the content. I'm lost.

If they were authorized to award degrees, they wouldn't have to issue them through Isabel I.

Spain's higher education system is different than the United States. There are no titulo propio degrees in the United States. Those degrees exist in Spain for people who only care to work in the private sector. Many graduates of such degrees understand that they can't use that degree to get a job in government or academia.

I lived in Spain and knew people who were successful with only a titulo propio degree. Some foreigners also obtain such degrees because it's more affordable. In the United States, many employers in the private sectors (excluding the Fortune 500 companies) won't care if you got a titulo propio degree. They care more about what you have studied and what you can do at work.

Can you name a Texas case, where someone got fined and/or imprisoned for using a titulo propio degree?

[Thorne]

If they were authorized to award degrees, they wouldn't have to issue them through Isabel I.

But...they don't have to issue them through Isabel? ENEB's Titulo Propio is legal in its own right.

As for Isabel, the 1973 Organic Law of Universities says they can legally issue Titulo Propio degrees and Isabel is accredited and in the RUCT database. The issuance of these degrees doesn't violate the laws regarding degree conferral where the school is located and the parent school is accredited by RUCT and ANECA and is recognized under ACUCYL, ENQA, and EQAR. All of these are recognized accreditation in the location where the school operates, the most salient of which is the official government database (the Register of Universities, Centers, and Titles) which lists the school as one of their 70-something legally accredited institutions.

I'm not qualified to interpret the law, though I suspect you aren't either unless you're secretly hiding a J.D. or ABA license. That being said, I've only found a few cases where this code was applied in Texas, all of them related to people saying they had degrees from schools that they did not have degrees from. I've not found a single case so far where a holder of a foreign degree was tried for using their foreign degree.

Plus, the code doesn't specifically mention any accreditation agencies specifically, not in section 3021. It mentions this vague and ominous, "as determined...for the sake of this section." This seems to suggest that a WES or ECE equivalency wouldn't necessarily meet the requirements unless the review board agrees. In all honesty, it may mean that a degree from out of state is questionable if they aren't accredited by SACS or authorized by Texas law to issue degrees in the state.

[Vle045]

Oh wait…. Never mind

[sanantone]

Xenophobia?  I suspect Oxford and Cambridge are not accredited.  I know the 30 - 40,000 student university I attended was not accredited.  It was a state university outside the US.  Most countries would not understand why accreditation would be needed when the state itself runs a school.

I'm sure that Oxford and Cambridge master's degrees would be evaluated as being the equivalent of an accredited master's degree from the U.S. since Oxford and Cambridge are authorized by their governments to issue degrees. 

With a school like ENEB, there might be an issue since they are not authorized to award degrees, and Isabel I won't issue transcripts. You can try all the credential evaluation services to see which one will evaluate the degree as an accredited master's degree.

Sanantone I get lost with you logic. Please help me out.

Which part of the Spanish law, under which they operate, does not permit them to award "titulos propios" or associate with a University to recognize the content. I'm lost.

If they were authorized to award degrees, they wouldn't have to issue them through Isabel I.

Spain's higher education system is different than the United States. There are no titulo propio degrees in the United States. Those degrees exist in Spain for people who only care to work in the private sector. Many graduates of such degrees understand that they can't use that degree to get a job in government or academia.

I lived in Spain and knew people who were successful with only a titulo propio degree. Some foreigners also obtain such degrees because it's more affordable. In the United States, many employers in the private sectors (excluding the Fortune 500 companies) won't care if you got a titulo propio degree. They care more about what you have studied and what you can do at work.  

Can you name a Texas case, where someone got fined and/or imprisoned for using a titulo propio degree?

There are schools with degree-granting authority awarding titulo propio degrees, including private schools like Isabel I and public schools. That is not the issue. The issue is that ENEB does not have degree-granting authority, and Isabel I will not issue transcripts for their students.

[Kab]

Xenophobia?  I suspect Oxford and Cambridge are not accredited.  I know the 30 - 40,000 student university I attended was not accredited.  It was a state university outside the US.  Most countries would not understand why accreditation would be needed when the state itself runs a school.

I'm sure that Oxford and Cambridge master's degrees would be evaluated as being the equivalent of an accredited master's degree from the U.S. since Oxford and Cambridge are authorized by their governments to issue degrees. 

With a school like ENEB, there might be an issue since they are not authorized to award degrees, and Isabel I won't issue transcripts. You can try all the credential evaluation services to see which one will evaluate the degree as an accredited master's degree.

Sanantone I get lost with you logic. Please help me out.

Which part of the Spanish law, under which they operate, does not permit them to award "titulos propios" or associate with a University to recognize the content. I'm lost.

If they were authorized to award degrees, they wouldn't have to issue them through Isabel I.

I understand how difficult can be to understand one's own educative system and how difficult can be to understand a foreign system.
I cannot find your point in all this.

[sanantone]

If they were authorized to award degrees, they wouldn't have to issue them through Isabel I.

But...they don't have to issue them through Isabel? ENEB's Titulo Propio is legal in its own right.

As for Isabel, the 1973 Organic Law of Universities says they can legally issue Titulo Propio degrees and Isabel is accredited and in the RUCT database. The issuance of these degrees doesn't violate the laws regarding degree conferral where the school is located and the parent school is accredited by RUCT and ANECA and is recognized under ACUCYL, ENQA, and EQAR. All of these are recognized accreditation in the location where the school operates, the most salient of which is the official government database (the Register of Universities, Centers, and Titles) which lists the school as one of their 70-something legally accredited institutions.

I'm not qualified to interpret the law, though I suspect you aren't either unless you're secretly hiding a J.D. or ABA license. That being said, I've only found a few cases where this code was applied in Texas, all of them related to people saying they had degrees from schools that they did not have degrees from. I've not found a single case so far where a holder of a foreign degree was tried for using their foreign degree.

Plus, the code doesn't specifically mention any accreditation agencies specifically, not in section 3021. It mentions this vague and ominous, "as determined...for the sake of this section." This seems to suggest that a WES or ECE equivalency wouldn't necessarily meet the requirements unless the review board agrees. In all honesty, it may mean that a degree from out of state is questionable if they aren't accredited by SACS or authorized by Texas law to issue degrees in the state.

I always find it amusing when people receive likes for being blatantly incorrect and not spending a minute to conduct research. That's no jab at you. I'm willing to provide the information, but it likely won't do anything for the cognitive dissonance and confirmation bias. 

I'm not an attorney, but I know how to do research instead of making a bunch of assumptions that can easily be cleared up with the use of a search engine. The law is written for the public to read and apply. Ignorance of the law is not an excuse. 

  (B) Upon the admission of a student to any graduate program, the institution shall document that the student is prepared to undertake graduate-level work by obtaining proof that the student holds a baccalaureate degree from an institution accredited by a recognized accrediting agency, or an institution holding a Certificate of Authority to offer baccalaureate degrees under the provisions of this chapter, or a degree from a foreign institution equivalent to a baccalaureate degree from an accredited institution. The procedures used by the institution for establishing the equivalency of a foreign degree shall be consistent with the guidelines of the National Council on the Evaluation of Foreign Educational Credentials or its successor.

https://texreg.sos.state.tx.us/public/readtac$ext.TacPage?sl=R&app=9&p_dir=&p_rloc=&p_tloc=&p_ploc=&pg=1&p_tac=&ti=19&pt=1&ch=7&rl=4

Why would there already be court cases over the ENEB degrees when the coupon deal hasn't been around for long? You're conflating the issue of foreign degrees with the issue of using a degree from a school that does not have degree-granting authority. Why would someone be taken to court over a foreign university that has degree-granting authority from its country? 

As for which U.S. accreditors THECB recognizes? That's easy to find on their website. Did you attempt a search before making that assertion? This would cut down on a lot of posts and wasted time. 

https://reportcenter.highered.texas.gov/agency-publication/miscellaneous/private-post-secondary-institution-accrediting-agencies-2018/

The State of Texas has banned the use of degrees from foreign schools based on other states' decisions and whether the schools had degree-granting authority from their government. To determine the equivalency of foreign degrees, the State of Texas uses NACES as its guide. 

http://www.ronkailey.com/InstitutionsWhoseDegreesAreIllegalToUseInTexas.html

  (ii) institutions located outside the United States that have demonstrated that their degrees are equivalent to degrees issued from an institution in the United States accredited by accrediting agencies recognized by the Board. The procedures for establishing that equivalency shall be consistent with the guidelines of the National Council on the Evaluation of Foreign Education Credentials, or its successor.

https://texreg.sos.state.tx.us/public/readtac$ext.TacPage?sl=R&app=9&p_dir=&p_rloc=&p_tloc=&p_ploc=&pg=1&p_tac=&ti=19&pt=1&ch=5&rl=46

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Xenophobia?  I suspect Oxford and Cambridge are not accredited.  I know the 30 - 40,000 student university I attended was not accredited.  It was a state university outside the US.  Most countries would not understand why accreditation would be needed when the state itself runs a school.

I'm sure that Oxford and Cambridge master's degrees would be evaluated as being the equivalent of an accredited master's degree from the U.S. since Oxford and Cambridge are authorized by their governments to issue degrees. 

With a school like ENEB, there might be an issue since they are not authorized to award degrees, and Isabel I won't issue transcripts. You can try all the credential evaluation services to see which one will evaluate the degree as an accredited master's degree.

Sanantone I get lost with you logic. Please help me out.

Which part of the Spanish law, under which they operate, does not permit them to award "titulos propios" or associate with a University to recognize the content. I'm lost.

If they were authorized to award degrees, they wouldn't have to issue them through Isabel I.

I understand how difficult can be to understand one's own educative system and how difficult can be to understand a foreign system.
I cannot find your point in all this.

It's simple. Does ENEB have degree-granting authority from Spain? That is what Texas is looking for. Will NACES evaluate an ENEB master's degree as an accredited master's degree? Texas relies on their evaluations. If it is not evaluated as an accredited master's degree, it might be illegal to advertise that you have a master's degree for employment purposes. If NACES does not recognize the ENEB degree as an accredited master's degree, will a transcript from Isabel I change the outcome, and can you get a transcript from Isabel I?

I don't understand your confusion. I am very well-versed on my country's accreditation system; you may not be. I don't know.