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[taylor]

burbuja, that's some excellent advice. Being a self employed broker, I hope I never have to do the whole job search again. But if I do, rest assured I will be rereading your post.

[burbuja0512]

burbuja, that's some excellent advice. Being a self employed broker, I hope I never have to do the whole job search again. But if I do, rest assured I will be rereading your post.

Thanks!!!! I have had to get pretty aggressive to move up the corporate ladder... especially since there are so few women that do what I do. Unfortunately the perception that a (relatively) young blonde woman can't cut it in international biz has made it REALLY tough on me, but overall, it's a good thing because I've had to get very creative!

[Westerner]

Yay! Congrats Rebel!

[topdog98]

Congratulations! We knew you could do it!

[mrs.b]

Congratulations, though it was not even a question! As far as negotiation strategies, burbuja's advice is exactly spot on. If you're on good terms with the HR rep serving as go-between and the hiring manager, just follow their lead on when it's time to stop being aggressive and accept the offer in front of you. I've seen some people negotiate so hard, our corporate office insisted the offer rescind and we give it to the next most-qualified. Some negotiation is often expected, though.

If they do not give on any ground, as others have said, you can always use it as a resume polisher for a year or two (stay for at least a year, else future employers will see it as opportunistic and question if they're just a stepping stone as well), then seek jobs willing to pay the worth of the job.

[taylor]

Thanks!!!! I have had to get pretty aggressive to move up the corporate ladder... especially since there are so few women that do what I do. Unfortunately the perception that a (relatively) young blonde woman can't cut it in international biz has made it REALLY tough on me, but overall, it's a good thing because I've had to get very creative!

Funny that you mention blondes. I have 2 partners in Shanghai and we are always bouncing off ideas what I can export to them in China instead of vice versa. I know you've mentioned that idea to me in the past too. What does the US have a surplus of that China doesn't? Cha-ching BLONDES! Once I capture that market you know what's next. Cha-ching GINGERS! Forget Mary Anns though, they got plenty of those, probably half a billion at least. They sell Mary Anns on closeouts as overstock items. I'll use you as the prototype and I'll invest in the mold. I'll give you 10%...I'd actually be willing to offer you 20% but now that I know you're such a good negotiator I need some wiggle room. So you in? hilarious

[burbuja0512]

Funny that you mention blondes. I have 2 partners in Shanghai and we are always bouncing off ideas what I can export to them in China instead of vice versa. I know you've mentioned that idea to me in the past too. What does the US have a surplus of that China doesn't? Cha-ching BLONDES! Once I capture that market you know what's next. Cha-ching GINGERS! Forget Mary Anns though, they got plenty of those, probably half a billion at least. They sell Mary Anns on closeouts as overstock items. I'll use you as the prototype and I'll invest in the mold. I'll give you 10%...I'd actually be willing to offer you 20% but now that I know you're such a good negotiator I need some wiggle room. So you in? hilarious

ROFLMAO.... you know it's funny how much better I do in international biz than some of my peers simply because certain areas of the world are fascinated with American women, regardless of hair color, but yes they especially love blondes. Not sure why that is, but I figure that if it's an advantage, I should use it! After all, it's so hard to break the glass ceiling in my line of work, I might as well get better results than the men I'm competing with

[rebel100]

Job accepted, $2/hour less than I hoped, significant raise nonetheless.

[cookderosa]

I never doubted it for a second!! Great job!!!

Here are my suggestions when it comes to negotiating salary, and there are various options/outcomes.

Best case scenario: They agree with you on $$ and manage to find budget to increase your pay to an amount you both agree upon.

However, it's more likely that they won't be able to exactly meet your expectations and if this happens here are other options:

1) Create a series of measurable goals along with a timeline that includes pay increases that correspond to attainment of each goal. It might span a year or two, but would bring you up to your desired hourly wage assuming that you meet what has been agreed upon. Of course if you do this, you'll have to include very aggressive targets in your plan. You'll have to show that you're going to increase departmental efficiency or have some other metric that shows how you're saving them time & money while simultaneously taking the department to a whole new level. If you do this, be prepared to work your a$$ off, but I'm certain you'll do this anyway, so why not have a plan to follow that will result in pay increases?

2) Agree to the best pay that they can offer, but negotiate heavily on title. If you look at my LinkedIn profile, you'll see that this is my strategy with my present employer. (Note that I just got promoted to Vice President of Global Sales! Why? Because I'm doing a great job, but there wasn't budget for the raise I deserve.) This is a great strategy and has worked very well for me, but depends heavily on the HR policies of your organization. Some companies absolutely will not allow you to have a higher title if you don't meet certain criteria. For example, if you don't have at least x number of direct reports, you can't be called a director. There is a way to circumvent these inflexible policies - create a new title. I know I'm starting to ramble here, but here is the concept: If your hospital HR has pre-determined protocols for manager, director, VP, etc, you simply create a title that doesn't exist and therefore has no rules surrounding it. So, if you don't like the title "manager" let's say, but they won't allow you to become a director, just ask to be called "department head" or something like that. This way you can at the very least show progression on your resume and use the title to get a better job if you're not able to get the $$$ you want within a year or two.

3) I have heard of people negotiating other benefits such as an extra week of vacation in lieu of extra pay, but since I have never attempted this, I can't say anything about it. However, it doesn't hurt to think of other ways to get something you want in exchange for the money you're not obtaining.

4) If they're not willing to work with you on anything, which is entirely possible, especially if the other candidates for the position are very well qualified, then you just have to suck it up and take the job. I just looked at your LinkedIn profile and you've already been there for 2 1/2 years, so you could just accept the promotion, modify your resume accordingly, and then start looking elsewhere if you're really unsatisfied. Don't jump ship quickly if you can survive on the salary.. really give it a shot to see if there are ways that you can use your results to boost your income, but I can tell you from experience that in some cases, when there is no budget, regardless of how well you're doing, there isn't anything that they can do, in spite of the best intentions. If this is what ends up happening, you'll just have to weigh the good and bad and decide how underpaid you really are compared to industry peers and how much you like your job. Ask yourself whether it's worth it to make a little less $$$ if you're really happy where you're at. Maybe you have a good work/life balance in your current job that you'd have to sacrifice if you went elsewhere.


I hope this helps somewhat. I've had a lot of experience with this and overall, I can't stress enough how much my aggressive negotiation with my employers regarding title has helped my career. The jobs I'm being recruited for are SOOOOO much better now and even though I'm not currently being paid what many of my industry peers make, the recruiters that have sought me out recently are approaching me with other VP positions that pay up to double what I'm making now. You already know about some of the stuff I've been working on, and it looks like my strategy is paying off. I'm still working out details, but will email you next week to let you know about what happened in Chicago.....

I knew you were awesome, I just have to remember to tell you more often! This is fantastic advice, I know I'm taking notes!!

[taylor]

ROFLMAO.... you know it's funny how much better I do in international biz than some of my peers simply because certain areas of the world are fascinated with American women, regardless of hair color, but yes they especially love blondes. Not sure why that is, but I figure that if it's an advantage, I should use it! After all, it's so hard to break the glass ceiling in my line of work, I might as well get better results than the men I'm competing with

We have a one year of opportunity to mass produce and export blondes to China. After that the CEO of Blondes Hugh Hefner will get wind of it and SMASH us like cockroaches. But that's ok because by then we will have made millions of dollars and moved on to our next project, GINGERS. All kidding aside what you've accomplished and what you continue to do is impressive. I mean working in a male dominated industry and then on top of that doing business in other countries not knowing the language and not knowing where you are half the time can be quite intimidating for male or female. Hey whatever advantage you have over your competition more power to you. I know I almost chose one Chinese supplier just because the company's VP of International Sales was HOT. But I snapped out of it because they were higher in price but had their price been close I probably would've chose them. Now I'm stuck Skyping with a HUGE Chinese guy who looks like Shrek, not easy on the eyes that's for sure. I should stop making fun of him because I know one day he'll tell me in a Jackie Chan accent, "I don't want any chwouble (trouble)!" I've watched enough kung fu movies to know that means he's ready to kick my arse.