Future relevance of business degrees?

[Gary]

I think business is a very important subject and we are all affected by business. I believe that more people should be taking business classes even if they are not business majors so they can have a better understanding on how things operate.

I couldn't agree more, especially at the high school level. Understanding finances and economics are crucial core competencies. Writing checks, balancing a checkbook, understanding credit card usage, these are the things young kids should be taught in school. I know I wasn't. As for the blue collar worker comment, I have to agree that while they can take great pride in the job they do, white collars have the better opportunities BUT Salary Smackdown: Blue Vs. White Collar - AOL Find a Job this was a little surprising. You better get licensing, certifications, etc. if you don't plan on getting a degree in the future, that will be your ticket. And I'm not talking about a BSL (like I have). Liberal studies degrees, I believe, won't offer that much in the future. Well rounded my butt! Companies want expertise, i.e. Business Administration, IT, engineering. When times are lean, like now, they are very selective, not unlike the military or feds and they want the meat, not the mashed potato(e)s (did I get the spelling right, Dan Quayle's got me all confused now). Let's face it, degree or no degree, if you have the right connections (networking), technology can change as fast as it wants to, you probably will always be ahead of the curve. As for gov't regulation, the problem is and we just saw this w/the credit card industry, new legislation just brings about more creative ideas to keep the pot-o-gold filled. Now those that were responsible users are being penalized, but, I won't go there. Rest assured that regardless of technology, humans are the center of the universe (money tree) and they will defeat technology (and regulations) every time. Whether you study Keynesian Theory or watch Carmen or Mad Money, the key is to join in Kumbaya with those that have a thirst for $$$$. My crowd always had a thrist for beer, my mistake.

Shift Happens.... two thumbs up w/a twirl

[94steve]

As for the blue collar worker comment, I have to agree that while they can take great pride in the job they do, white collars have the better opportunities BUT Salary Smackdown: Blue Vs. White Collar - AOL Find a Job this was a little surprising. You better get licensing, certifications, etc.

My girlfriend is an MBA student with an undergrad. degree in finance from a private university. I am a stationary engineer in an NYC commercial office building. She earns 52k a year sans bonus. I rake in $66,165 sans overtime. I am degreeless right now but I do hold many licenses and certifications.

The blue collar/white collar comment is soley about demand elasticity. The demand curve for the professional (meaning real professionals like doctors, lawyers, CPA's, and PE's not "certified multilevel marketers" and other self branded "professionals") is nearly inelastic. In addition to having many years of training they have the government on their side limiting supply via a strict credentialing process and the government also makes sure the professional is always in demand via various mandates and regulations. For example, no matter what new construction technology gets invented, highway plans will still need the stamp of a PE on them.

On the flipside, demand for high school dropouts is close to perfectly elastic. Jobs commonly held by dropouts such as fruit picker, car wash dryer, and landscaper are often seasonal and are very vulnerable to the business cycle and technological progress. In addition, there are no barriers to entry and government stimulus of demand is limited to subsidies for the industries as a whole and pork barrel spending. What I mean is my cat is qualifies to dry the cars at the car wash (he is big, furry, and trainable for a cat) and the most government stimulus of demand you'll see is maybe an unfunded mandate for the all municipalities in the state to get their vehicle fleet washed at private car washes. A bad economy will decrease demand for fruit, lower the amount of cars being washed and amount of carwash tips, and people will cut their own grass when they get laid off. Development of a new fruit picking machine, robotic car dryer, or robotic lawn mower would erase the jobs of these people in the blink of an eye.

So you see, the closer you get to entering a profession the more your occupation's elasticity curve approaches that of a vertical line. The closer you get to being a fruit picker, the more horizontal your elasticity curve becomes. This is what I am arguing. Educational attainment as it relates to worker satisfaction and social class is an entirely different ballgame but the professionals seem to win that one too.

Anyway, who says that us wiley non traditional adult learner types don't engage in interesting classroom discussions, written papers, etc? Pah-rumf Pah-rumf, Pah-rumf.

[MelB8tz]

94steve definitely just took Microeconomics! Love the way you were able to apply it all while explaining, makes perfect sense.

[Chebasaz]

Steve, you mentioned earlier that technology degrees holders faced much the same dangers. The world is changing, and the specialization you learned in college is going to be obsolete 10 years from now. I'd both agree and disagree.

Take a look at the steam engineers of the late 19th/early 20th century. Steam engines were everywhere, and a person who was able to repair and make them work was raking in the money. Then comes this new fangled contraption called the internal combustion engine, and over a few decades time an entire career field almost ceases to exist. I imagine farriers went through the same thing when those darn motorwagons were first making their debut.

In the first example, the skill-set needed (mechanical aptitude and an engineering background) are the same. The steam engineers who were forward-looking probably made the transition successfully. The farrier had a harder time of it since there was little applicable translation for his skill-set. He either had to learn a new skill or relocate to where his skill was still needed. The farriers who were forward-looking were able to see this quickly and prepare accordingly.

The 20 year bolt tightener, if staying abreast of developments in auto manufacturing, might have heard about that robot long before it was implemented at his Ford plant. That knowledge would have given him time to prepare, and either learn another skill or find another position in the plant that can't be replaced as easily (robot supervisor?).

Always keeping an eye on the horizon of your chosen field will insulate you no matter your profession. Staying up to date isn't enough; you need to look at what the future holds too. I'm in IT, and often get asked what certification or education people should get for job security or to get promoted. My advice is always the same - If you want to succeed, don't stop at what you need today. Rather identify the education, technical knowledge, certifications that you'll need tomorrow. You'll never get left behind, and when the opportunity for advancement comes, you'll be ready for it.

Short answer - Be prepared!

[Basket Weaver]

Nice thread, thought I'd copy some from a post I just entered seeing how revelant it is:


One thing I wanted to post, from my experience this past year and a half anyways: If you feel the desire to pursue a Master's Degree, make sure that it's a requirement for the job you're pursuing. It is a heck of a lot of work just to find out that the job doesn't even require one or you won't earn any more; it is NOT automatic that you'll be paid more because you have a masters! Additionally, when it comes to the pay you can expect, don't be deluded by the school regurgitating their statistics that if you have XX degree you can expect to be paid XX amount more; I think this is simply a marketing ploy to lure you into the school so they can make money (college is simply a business...nothing more). While it may be true in certain areas, it may not be in your geographical location. The unemployment lines are now saturated with highly educated people looking for jobs. Employers know this and are paying whatever they want because they know people need to work to support their families. While I do believe having a degree is important, its not the Saviour it's cracked up to be. Having a degree coupled with experience is just as important...if not more so; keep all of this in mind when contemplating higher education, no matter what level the degree. Just my two cents worth...anyone else running into something different?

[JanusthePhoenix]

Employers know this and are paying whatever they want because they know people need to work to support their families.

I've seen a few Craigslist job ads for my area paying as much as 2 bucks less than legal minimum wage.

[tbradford1]

Thanks for the interesting answers, people. I would like to add though, that I was thinking a little bigger in the 'change' department. As opposed to the difference between VHS and DVD, I was thinking of the difference between the way wars were conducted pre and post Napoleon. Fundamental changes in the way things are done. Example: people keep talking about how the stock market will never be the same, it's a whole new ball game, etc. If the structural changes in finance and banking are as significant as 'they' say they will be, then all of us will have to unlearn almost everything about finance and a lot of every other subject that finance ties into. The consequences of something like that would not be entirely clear for decades, at least to most people. (Or perhaps the media is blowing things out of proportion again...I don't know, I'm not a finance expert)

Perrik, you've got the right attitude. I think perhaps being unemployed for so long and having never really been in the big business world and therefore having my finger solidly off the pulse is making me a bit nervous.

For business as a whole, the fundamentals will likely never change significantly (at least not quickly). When it comes down to it, companies need to figure out how to sell their products (or services) to customers, figure out a way to get the products to the customers, and track and report the results. The basics of this process are not going to change anytime soon, we just all need to stay up to date in how these basic processes are best accomplished.

[Gary]

Let's not forget certain other elements you can work on to stay in contention w/your environment. Don't burn bridges, laugh at all your supervisor's/bosses stupid jokes, volunteer for coffee runs, Kiss Butt, did I say Kiss Butt? A strategic brownoser can be a rewarding, if an undistinguished position. So, in overview, keep an eye on the elastic/inelastic lines (I always hated economic charts), get certifications/qualifications, pursue a usable degree, keep forwardthinking and backward nosing. There, that about "covers it".

[94steve]

Let's not forget certain other elements you can work on to stay in contention w/your environment. Don't burn bridges, laugh at all your supervisor's/bosses stupid jokes, volunteer for coffee runs, Kiss Butt, did I say Kiss Butt? A strategic brownoser can be a rewarding, if an undistinguished position. So, in overview, keep an eye on the elastic/inelastic lines (I always hated economic charts), get certifications/qualifications, pursue a usable degree, keep forwardthinking and backward nosing. There, that about "covers it".

KISS THAT BOOTY!!!
hilarious

[perrik]

Let's not forget certain other elements you can work on to stay in contention w/your environment. Don't burn bridges, laugh at all your supervisor's/bosses stupid jokes, volunteer for coffee runs, Kiss Butt, did I say Kiss Butt? A strategic brownoser can be a rewarding, if an undistinguished position. So, in overview, keep an eye on the elastic/inelastic lines (I always hated economic charts), get certifications/qualifications, pursue a usable degree, keep forwardthinking and backward nosing. There, that about "covers it".

Yeah, pretty much!

I always try to explain to children that "Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer" is just a thinly-disguised lesson about office politics from which they could learn the grim reality of the working world. I'm no longer allowed to talk to a lot of children. :p