2nd bachelor's vs. 1 st master's: continued from other thread

[Kaz]

I am creating this thread in order continue a discussion that started over here but strayed off topic: http://www.degreeforum.net/general-educa...-bsba.html

Short and sweet my point is a master's degree probably is a better choice than a second bachelor's degree, but it is not a no-brainer absolutely better choice. People are on this forum for different reasons:

• Sometimes the fastest degree possible is the most important thing.
  
• Sometimes the cheapest degree possible is the most important thing.
  
• Sometimes the easiest degree possible is the most important thing.
  
• Sometimes the best transfer of previously earned credits possible is the most important thing.
  
• Sometimes fitting in credits around real life wherever and whenever life let's you is the most important thing.
  
• Sometimes someone shows up on this forum with a brand new thing we've never heard of before that is the most important thing.
  

As such we should be wary of assuming things in our advice that were never actually stated. Getting a first master's degree versus a second bachelor's shouldn't just be answered with "get the master's" without parsing the exact situation of the person asking. For me in particular I am considering getting a BSBA from TESC or COSC after I am done with my BA double-major at Excelsior. In that original thread I never said when I would be pursuing it, which is something one should ask before making assumptions or doling out advice. I also stated I am finishing the BA without having taken any CLEPs or DSSTs or UExcels or TECEPs or anything other than a subject GRE under the old Excelsior rules (I might be the last Excelsior grad to do so! :coolgleam: lol). That means I have all of them at my disposal and meeting the requirements for a second bachelor's with all of that available firepower is very appealing.

I also explained why coupling a BSBA with something else is an easy sell in an interview. I didn't say any old second bachelor's is a good idea. Basically, most jobs are jobs that already combine both: a specific subject matter plus trying to make money from it. Most everyone either gets a degree in the subject (which leaves us unschooled in the business side of things) or in business (which leaves us unschooled as to the specifics of any given subject). If it is cheap and easy to get degrees in both it can look good to people that you are not utterly clueless in 50% of what you will be hired for.

Grad school is almost always a big step up in workload and expectations from professors as compared to most undergrad classes. Most people on this (and other) forums say that banging out CLEPs and what-not was easier than even their undergrad classes. Putting these two things together means comparing a 30-36 credit MBA to a 50'ish credit BSBA that can be completed entirely with CLEPs/DSSTs/etc. is comparing apples to oranges. Right this second I don't think I could pass any given grad-level business course, let alone simply keep up with the reading and writing involved, but I could pass several DSSTs right this second. This also involves the speed aspect in my bullet points.

Work experience also came up. Almost no one on this forum, including me, would tell someone to forego available work in order to pick up a second bachelor's. For some reason that got assumed in the previous thread but it shouldn't have been because like I said almost no one would give that advice. I'd say most of us on this forum are adults who are working and trying to get a degree while doing so. If any assumption can be justified based on spending time on this forum it would be this: fitting a degree plan in while working.

[Prloko]

This is articulated so eloquently. You basically stated every thought that came in my head when someone would try to bully their opinion (cheaper vs faster, etc.).

I always try to give two options that may fit to the OP, but then here comes the usual suspects to tear down what was suggested and insisting that only cheaper or faster, etc is better. Yet many of us don't even stop to think who we are getting this life changing advice from. Are they working in their chosen field? Did they go through a school/career path, but yet realized that cheaper wasn't actually the best and are now redirecting?

It seems the once helpful and supportive nature of this forum has become some sort of sounding board for people who feel the need to be right over the need to be helpful. I don't think I would have finished my degree the way I did without the supportive people. I feel had I joined now, I may have been turned off by some of the folks on here (even some forum veterans here).

I am creating this thread in order continue a discussion that started over here but strayed off topic: http://www.degreeforum.net/general-educa...-bsba.html

Short and sweet my point is a master's degree probably is a better choice than a second bachelor's degree, but it is not a no-brainer absolutely better choice. People are on this forum for different reasons:

• Sometimes the fastest degree possible is the most important thing.
  
• Sometimes the cheapest degree possible is the most important thing.
  
• Sometimes the easiest degree possible is the most important thing.
  
• Sometimes the best transfer of previously earned credits possible is the most important thing.
  
• Sometimes fitting in credits around real life wherever and whenever life let's you is the most important thing.
  
• Sometimes someone shows up on this forum with a brand new thing we've never heard of before that is the most important thing.
  

As such we should be wary of assuming things in our advice that were never actually stated. Getting a first master's degree versus a second bachelor's shouldn't just be answered with "get the master's" without parsing the exact situation of the person asking. For me in particular I am considering getting a BSBA from TESC or COSC after I am done with my BA double-major at Excelsior. In that original thread I never said when I would be pursuing it, which is something one should ask before making assumptions or doling out advice. I also stated I am finishing the BA without having taken any CLEPs or DSSTs or UExcels or TECEPs or anything other than a subject GRE under the old Excelsior rules (I might be the last Excelsior grad to do so! :coolgleam: lol). That means I have all of them at my disposal and meeting the requirements for a second bachelor's with all of that available firepower is very appealing.

I also explained why coupling a BSBA with something else is an easy sell in an interview. I didn't say any old second bachelor's is a good idea. Basically, most jobs are jobs that already combine both: a specific subject matter plus trying to make money from it. Most everyone either gets a degree in the subject (which leaves us unschooled in the business side of things) or in business (which leaves us unschooled as to the specifics of any given subject). If it is cheap and easy to get degrees in both it can look good to people that you are not utterly clueless in 50% of what you will be hired for.

Grad school is almost always a big step up in workload and expectations from professors as compared to most undergrad classes. Most people on this (and other) forums say that banging out CLEPs and what-not was easier than even their undergrad classes. Putting these two things together means comparing a 30-36 credit MBA to a 50'ish credit BSBA that can be completed entirely with CLEPs/DSSTs/etc. is comparing apples to oranges. Right this second I don't think I could pass any given grad-level business course, let alone simply keep up with the reading and writing involved, but I could pass several DSSTs right this second. This also involves the speed aspect in my bullet points.

Work experience also came up. Almost no one on this forum, including me, would tell someone to forego available work in order to pick up a second bachelor's. For some reason that got assumed in the previous thread but it shouldn't have been because like I said almost no one would give that advice. I'd say most of us on this forum are adults who are working and trying to get a degree while doing so. If any assumption can be justified based on spending time on this forum it would be this: fitting a degree plan in while working.

[KittenMittens]

This is articulated so eloquently. You basically stated every thought that came in my head when someone would try to bully their opinion (cheaper vs faster, etc.).

I always try to give two options that may fit to the OP, but then here comes the usual suspects to tear down what was suggested and insisting that only cheaper or faster, etc is better. Yet many of us don't even stop to think who we are getting this life changing advice from. Are they working in their chosen field? Did they go through a school/career path, but yet realized that cheaper wasn't actually the best and are now redirecting?

It seems the once helpful and supportive nature of this forum has become some sort of sounding board for people who feel the need to be right over the need to be helpful. I don't think I would have finished my degree the way I did without the supportive people. I feel had I joined now, I may have been turned off by some of the folks on here (even some forum veterans here).

Good thing you joined before now then, though so far, a few members have told me both privately, and publicly they have been grateful for my advice, and feedback, and they certainly didn't feel turned off or lacking in any support, so I guess that for every person that complains, there's ten more that don't

No one’s trying to bully any opinion except perhaps you with your indirect personal attacks. Just some noise over nothing - it’s perfectly reasonable to consider time and work experience into a second bachelor’s degree which is a certainly worth considering before pursuing a second degree, so its certainly relevant to the original thread. And for the record, that person in question who posted about the degree has PMed me in the past before, has been actively receiving my input on pursuing her goals and is doing a B.S. in BA from COSC as well, so I know a bit about her background and goals, and I have an idea of what she's trying to do - don't presume so much about what you may not know.

Although you may have a grind to axe with me because of any perceived affronts and/or personal insecurities you may have, I’d hardly say it's constructive to personally attack others as you've done a few times now; ironically, it’s as much of a sounding board for everyone including yourself - though it's a personal policy for myself to refrain from rebuking or censoring others no matter how much I may disagree with them. Believe it or not, but any community fails to become supportive when it fails to tolerate dissent and opinion - that's why we have a republic and not democracy which is also known colloquially known as tyranny of the masses. I’m sorry but I’m putting you on ignore now as you’ve repeatedly tried to stir the pot with me several times now; I’d recommend you do the same too if you don’t like what I or anyone else has to say. World's not going to end because of a difference in opinion - I sleep well at night knowing that people have minds of their own, can figure things out and know what's best for themselves. Have a good night then.

[Kaz]

This is articulated so eloquently. You basically stated every thought that came in my head when someone would try to bully their opinion (cheaper vs faster, etc.).

I always try to give two options that may fit to the OP, but then here comes the usual suspects to tear down what was suggested and insisting that only cheaper or faster, etc is better. Yet many of us don't even stop to think who we are getting this life changing advice from. Are they working in their chosen field? Did they go through a school/career path, but yet realized that cheaper wasn't actually the best and are now redirecting?

It seems the once helpful and supportive nature of this forum has become some sort of sounding board for people who feel the need to be right over the need to be helpful. I don't think I would have finished my degree the way I did without the supportive people. I feel had I joined now, I may have been turned off by some of the folks on here (even some forum veterans here).

Thank you for that. Maybe this board is getting cranky in its old age lol. I just remember discovering this forum and this entirely different avenue to complete one's degree years ago and how so many people had so many different stories, including me. I'm a math major, how many of those are on this board? Yet I am going to graduate from Excelsior with that major and I only knew I could do that, and how to do that, by coming here getting help, especially from alissaroot (thanks Alissa!). The "easy/cheap/fast" threads didn't apply to me, but I found them interesting nonetheless and learned a lot reading them. But mostly I learned you had to get as complete a picture of the person asking the question in order to help them because if someone didn't know what I personally was going for the advice was at best a waste of time. So I try and really understand what the person is asking and answer exactly that question, and usually little else.

[videogamesrock]

I don't think excelsior allows double majors. I emailed them A few months back and they said they don't offer that.

[Kaz]

I don't think excelsior allows double majors. I emailed them A few months back and they said they don't offer that.

I guess I'm the last one of that too lol! Seriously though that is an interesting, and sad, change if that's true now. I'm locked into an older policy so it doesn't affect me but I'll look into it.

[Tedium]

Well, I'm considering a BSBA from COSC after my BA English, because I want to be able to get an entry-level job in accounting/bookkeeping/office work/whatever. I need to get my foot in the door and many of these jobs require a 2 or 4 year degree in Bus. Admin., Finance, or Accounting. I feel like going into these jobs with an MBA is overkill and might even be seen as suspect by some hiring managers.

If at some point in my future career I hit a ceiling for not having an MBA, I'll revisit the idea. I just need to get in on the ground level before I worry about a master's. Not to mention, I don't feel like I have enough time to complete 30-42 hours of graduate coursework. Like you said, Kaz: It's easier and cheaper for me to test out of all but two courses for a BSBA. It's the best fit for me at this period in my life.

[bricabrac]

If at some point in my future career I hit a ceiling for not having an MBA, I'll revisit the idea. I just need to get in on the ground level before I worry about a master's. Not to mention, I don't feel like I have enough time to complete 30-42 hours of graduate coursework. Like you said, Kaz: It's easier and cheaper for me to test out of all but two courses for a BSBA. It's the best fit for me at this period in my life.

You are correct, get your foot in the door. Hopefully you choose a company that has a tuition reimbursement program. Then when you are ready let the company foot the bill for your masters degree. That's how it's done in my neck of the woods.

[Kaz]

Well, I'm considering a BSBA from COSC after my BA English, because I want to be able to get an entry-level job in accounting/bookkeeping/office work/whatever. I need to get my foot in the door and many of these jobs require a 2 or 4 year degree in Bus. Admin., Finance, or Accounting. I feel like going into these jobs with an MBA is overkill and might even be seen as suspect by some hiring managers.

If at some point in my future career I hit a ceiling for not having an MBA, I'll revisit the idea. I just need to get in on the ground level before I worry about a master's. Not to mention, I don't feel like I have enough time to complete 30-42 hours of graduate coursework. Like you said, Kaz: It's easier and cheaper for me to test out of all but two courses for a BSBA. It's the best fit for me at this period in my life.

That makes sense. Since we are sharing, I am going to wind up with a BA in mathematics but I have been thinking about trying to become an actuary for the last several years now. That requires a lot of math, and a bachelor's in maths is the normal entry path, but it is more than that. There is the Society of Actuaries which you basically have to join. They have requirements beyond a math degree, namely their tests but also verifiable knowledge of economics and finance. I will wind up taking undergrad courses in stuff like econometrics after I graduate with the BA regardless of pursuing a BSBA, MBA, MA in maths, etc. Same with finance.

More over, if that path doesn't materialize for some reason, I actually now have more years on my resume as manager in a blue-collar/grey-collar environment than I do anything else. And the most recent year is in a niche that would actually most naturally go along with an environmental science degree! That wasn't by design but hey, story of my life cheersmate So I have been seriously looking at the BSBA down the line because that is so universal. Life keeps curveballing me so a Swiss-Army-knife-type of educational background has been making more and more sense.

I've explored other ideas too but nothing grabs me. I could see becoming a math teacher down the line but I have a couple friends who teach high school math and it sounds like a real mixed bag, plus I'd have to do alternate route teaching qualification since I don't have any education credits let alone a degree in education. Same general story with my other major: psychology. I kind of wound up with that "by accident" because of the old Excelsior GRE rules, so I'll get a legit BA in psych but there is no way I could step into a job that relied on it. Not immediately after graduation at least.

Ok I'm rambling. Time for bed eeya:

[Tedium]

You are correct, get your foot in the door. Hopefully you choose a company that has a tuition reimbursement program. Then when you are ready let the company foot the bill for your masters degree. That's how it's done in my neck of the woods.

Man, that would be heaven for me. In a perfect world, that's exactly what I would want to happen. Here's hoping!