TESC BBA CIS or Computer Science? Which is better for employers

[mm1988]

I'm doing Computer Science now, but I'm think about switching to the Computer Information Systems. For those of you that have that degree, is it harder to get a job in the software fields? I'm researching jobs and most of them say Computer Science or equivalent. Would the equivalent be considered CIS? I'm planning to pursue get a Master's degree in CS right after I graduate.

[dcan]

Depends on what your goals are.

BSBA CIS is a business degree with a concentration in computers. You can learn things like programming, IT project management, network security, IT management, etc. The focus is on adding value to the business through programming and management because you understand the business world. Computer Science is a science degree (ok, liberal arts in TESC's weird world, whatever) and you learn advanced math, advanced programming, compiler design, operating system design, etc.

If you want a job doing the latter, computer science, if the former, BSBA CIS.

Personal example: I'm going BSBA CIS, mainly because I have an AAS degree in computer programming, have 17 years computer experience working for the government, and want to learn more about the business world. Plus, even though I've played with tons of languages and platforms, most of my "real" jobs involve more program management than actual coding, and even though I *love* programming I don't know that I can hack the highest maths, so my future is in CIS, no COS. I will however study discrete math and would like to squeeze in a data structures course and an algorithm course, but I don't think the last two will fit my plan.

You can of course fill up computer and free electives with computer science courses, so you get a business degree AND can demonstrate insane technical knowledge to all future employers. If I didn't already have my AAS fill up my free electives I might have considered that route...

PS TESC COS courses also qualify as gen ed credits in case you go BSBA... Thomas Edison State College | General Education Electives

[ryoder]

Dcan is right. In the real world very few of us do computer science. I am a lead developer and sometimes called an architect. I program fifty percent of the time on a good day. I never have used math higher than pre algebra in my programming. Most applications simply don't require it. You really need to understand object oriented programming, database design and development, distributed processing, web services, web development including HTML CSS and JavaScript and maybe some other topics like basic information security. I have been employed as a computer programmer since 1997 and only one job required trig and matrix math and I was doing graphics programming so that makes sense. Most programmers i know have never done any graphics programming and typically just write backend code that reads data from a database and writes it to another database or displays it on the screen for editing. This sounds overly simplified but definitely know how to build a GUI around a database with some business logic. Build an order entry system for fun for a lemonade stand. Print out a report for week end and month end.

[Chebasaz]

Being in IT myself, I'd also point out that CompSci degrees (at least these days) fill extremely specialized needs. The CIS degree would probably help you out more in the general IT world for exactly the reasons that Dcan and ryoder mentioned. In my opinion, the entire academic "Computer Science" field is in need of an overhaul. It's no longer the "catch-all" that it was 20-30 years ago. The industry has evolved beyond that.

As for your original question - I can't speak for everyone, but when hiring developers I'd accept either degree. Each provides a base of knowledge. I'm more concerned with what they've done with that base. How well can they fill the need that I have at the current time? In my inner mind, I may expect a CompSci developer to be bit more on the ball as that's all the degree concentrates on, but that usually also means he/she has no management experience. A good developer with project management skills is a gift from on-high. Helps keep the rest of the 'unique' personalities happy and productive. (No offense to any developers present)

[Bunbu]

While we're discussing differences can we throw Excelsior's Information Technology to the discussion? It looks like a CS minus some higher math...

[ryoder]

The IT curriculum is typically heavy on programming, database, networking and a little bit of project management. These are the important things in most run of the mill IT jobs that are so plentiful these days. Computer science and research are not done by many. I think an IT undergrad followed by years of experience and an MBA would be a great path.

That said, you can't go wrong with any of these choices but know that you have to put time in outside of work and school to build and keep your skills sharp.

[dcan]

A good developer with project management skills is a gift from on-high. Helps keep the rest of the 'unique' personalities happy and productive.

Sez the guy with the PMP?? milelol:

[dcan]

While we're discussing differences can we throw Excelsior's Information Technology to the discussion? It looks like a CS minus some higher math...

It looks like a decent program actually. Now it's got me re-considering TESC BSBA. But Calc may make me want to shoot myself... :ack:

Me personally I angled toward the business degree for reasons stated earlier. I figured it would look good to have a broader background and understanding of both gov't and the business world. The downside to a broad background however is the jack-of-all-master-of-none syndrome.

I never have used math higher than pre algebra in my programming. Most applications simply don't require it.

Though I would have previously agreed with you 100%, I will say now that I'm looking into discrete math more I'm finding this to be untrue. If you program at all you are DOING higher-order math whether you realize it or not. Logic, sets, relational algebra, relational calculus, matrices (arrays), graph theory, etc. We use all of it, day in and day out, without even realizing it most of the time.

I'm brushing up for the College Math CLEP and keep getting sucked into discrete math, logic and especially deeper into set theory which is just blowing my mind 20 years after learning the basics in high school. I have a much deeper understanding and appreciation for my craft in just the past few days as a result.

Some other outstanding advice: I'm graduating with a Computer Science degree but I don't feel like I know how to program. - Programmers - Stack Exchange

[Chebasaz]

Sez the guy with the PMP?? milelol:

Ah, but I'm not a developer, hence the "no offense".

One of the best developers our team ever had was absolutely brilliant, yet somehow thought it was a a good idea to go have coins made (actual coins, he sent off for them) with our logo on one side and a black hole illustration on the other. Then started handing them out to our clients saying "I feel this is an accurate description of where your money is going." When I later asked him what in the $#&! he was thinking, he said it all started with an argument his team lead and him had over how something was going to be done. He didn't agree with the lead's decision, so figured he better warn the customers. All made perfect sense to him. /sigh

This is one example of almost a decade of similar stories. I wasn't kidding about the worth of a developer with PM skills. Show me a developer (doesn't even have to be a great one) that can act as a manager and keep the rest of the team sorta-happy and productive, and I will pay that man/woman extremely well.

P.S. - The black hole rock-star now works in Redmond. I have no doubt that Microsoft has someone watching him like a hawk, but also no doubt that he's doing great things for them. Guy was a brilliant programmer, but good lord I wanted to kill him at times.

[ryoder]

I see what you mean dcan about discrete math but I did try to study discrete math and the set arithmetic was fine it was the darn proofs that I had trouble with.


Dcan, I know what you mean about developers. I consider myself a programmer through and through and a techie but I am great at whiteboarding and having conversations with the enterprise business analyst and, VPs and CTO over a beer. I am not so good with motivating lackluster employees into stellar performance or keeping a burndown chart up to date however. I have studied leadership, HR management, the history of management, project management and many other topics but don't know how successful managers do what they do.