Which School to Choose for a Dual Baccalaureate Degree, COSC or TESC?

[Chicagoinvictus]

Hello and Thanks to all for some excellent suggestions and input. I e-mailed COSC yesterday to get input on enrollment and the dual degree, so far I have not received a reply. I attempted to call TESC today and could only leave a detailed message seeking information on enrollment and dual degree. I also e-mailed the TESC academic advisor at Great Lakes and asked to setup an in-person counseling session. Hopefully I will hear back from them in the next day or so, I will call Great Lakes tomorrow too.

With that said, from what I am reading it appears that TESC may suit my purposes best. I am seeking a dual degree with both listed on the diploma and transcripts. I may look into getting a joint social science/history or criminal justice degree. I didn't realize that I am finished with the requirements for the social science degree already. This site and the people on here are an awesome source of information!

I do have some questions:
1. What degree would be best for a future Masters degree, social science or history?
2. If I go the TESC route there is no cornerstone course, only a capstone?
3. If I do a dual major do I have to do two capstone courses?
4. Any suggestions on pursuing my Masters degree at TESC and how many of my existing baccalaureate credits could I use towards it?
5. I was planning on enrolling as a per credit tuition plan, someone recommended the Enrolled Options Tuition Plan which appears to be the more costly approach, any advice?
6. How fast can I get this done? I sent my SMART transcript and my official college transcripts to TESC on February 20,2014 and haven't heard anything. I will apply tonight.
7. What is the big difference between a dual degree and two separate degrees at once? Aren't they essentially the same thing? I didn't follow the advice about getting two separate degrees at the same time, what is the advantage?
8. Can I enroll and begin graduate level classes while finishing my Baccalaureate degree?
9. Any suggestions on a fast Masters program that is priced right?

My goal is to get this accomplished as quickly as possible and move on to obtaining a Masters degree. I am seeking the Masters degree for personal satisfaction and as a credential for future plans, one of which is to teach at the collegiate level one day. Any advice on the Masters degree would be appreciated too. I am thinking of either history or criminal justice, both are fields that I enjoy and am familiar with both professionally and as a hobbyist. There is so much information out there, I have researched the boards for awhile and figured now was the time to act.

Thank you all!

[KayV]

If one of your goals is to teach at the community college level, you will need at least 18 graduate hours with the same prefix as the classes you want to teach. So, when you look for a graduate program be sure it offers that option. Western New Mexico University's MA in Interdisciplinary Studies would give you 18 hours each in History and Criminal Justice, and it's pretty affordable (search the forum for more info). Just the Social Science degree would be fine for being accepted into that program. You would not need a Cornerstone at TESC.

[Yanji]

I'll try to answer what I can.

1. Probably History, as it is a specific major unlike Social Science which is an interdisciplinary major. It's unlikely that either route will close any doors to you, except perhaps a history degree.
2. Yes, there is no such thing as a cornerstone at TESC.
3. AFAIK, you cannot take LIB-495 (liberal arts capstone) twice.
4. TESC has a bachelor's to master's program which can help a little bit, but it means you can take up to 9 graduate credits at TESC at the undergraduate rate to save you some time/money. There are cheaper Master's degree options out there than TESC.
5. The per credit tuition has a residency requirement, which can be fulfilled at least partially with TECEPs, but seeing as you are so close to a degree, the Enrolled Options Plan will be the fastest route.
6. If you take a route like KayV or bricabrac propsed, a matter of months and then just waiting for graduation.
7. Having a BSBA can help in a job search if you want to prove you have some business training, but otherwise there's no added utility from a liberal arts degree, imo.
8. See 4.
9. Indiana State, Louisiana - Monroe and Nebraska - Kearney all offer History degrees for ~$10-17k. Alabama's 30-credit $11k BA in Human Environmental Sciences (pretty much a general studies MA) is, imo, one of the greatest bargains in US higher education.

[laughter]

With that said, from what I am reading it appears that TESC may suit my purposes best. I am seeking a dual degree with both listed on the diploma and transcripts. I may look into getting a joint social science/history or criminal justice degree.

From what I understand, your diploma certificate will only state that you have graduated with a Bachelor of Arts degree (not BA in History and CJ); your social science / history and CJ areas of study will be listed in your transcript, I think.

2. If I go the TESC route there is no cornerstone course, only a capstone?

That's correct, TESC requires a capstone, whereas COSC requires a cornerstone.

3. If I do a dual major do I have to do two capstone courses?

Only one capstone course is required. Just to clarify, TESC does not call this a dual major, rather a bachelor's degree with two areas of study. Check out "Two Areas of Study Within One Degree" at Award of Degrees.

4. Any suggestions on pursuing my Masters degree at TESC and how many of my existing baccalaureate credits could I use towards it?
8. Can I enroll and begin graduate level classes while finishing my Baccalaureate degree?

Check out "Bachelor's to Master's Program" at Award of Degrees. It's possible to earn 9 graduate credits which will apply to both your undergraduate and graduate TESC degrees, however, there are certain requirements that must be met. I'm not sure about those baccalaureate credits you've already earned.... check that out with TESC.

5. I was planning on enrolling as a per credit tuition plan, someone recommended the Enrolled Options Tuition Plan which appears to be the more costly approach, any advice?

It depends on whether you wish to graduate as fast as possible or to graduate via the most economic route. With the Per Credit tuition plan, you'll have to fulfill a residency requirement of 24 TESC credits (courses or TECEPs) which would mean delaying you're graduation date. Since you have all the credits required for a BA Social Science (except for the capstone course), the Enrolled Options will allow you to graduate as soon as possible, albeit at a higher cost. From another perspective, if you wish to complete a second degree within one year, then that'd be a different story.

6. How fast can I get this done? I sent my SMART transcript and my official college transcripts to TESC on February 20,2014 and haven't heard anything. I will apply tonight.

TESC will only evaluate your transcripts once you have applied and paid the application fee. You'll have to wait a few weeks before they publish the academic evaluation. How fast? As fast as you can go. The capstone will take about 3 months to complete.

7. What is the big difference between a dual degree and two separate degrees at once? Aren't they essentially the same thing? I didn't follow the advice about getting two separate degrees at the same time, what is the advantage?

No, they are different. A dual degree is what TESC calls "one bachelor's degree with two areas of study". TESC does not award two bachelor's degrees simultaneously; they can award one bachelor's degree and one associate's degree simultaneously. Two separate degrees would mean that you complete the BA in Social Science/History and CJ first and apply for graduation then only complete the second degree in BSBA General Management. However, you can start working on the second degree even before graduating with the first degree, as long as the date of completion (for those additional 24 credits in the second degree) recorded on the ACE transcript falls after the graduation date of your first degree.

[Chicagoinvictus]

Wow, Thank You once again! This blog is an invaluable source of information, much prompter and more efficient than the actual schools. I have made my mind up and will be attending TESC. I am submitting the application right now and will hopefully make contact with an advisor tomorrow. I am excited about this and very appreciative to those who have helped me gather the missing pieces. If only I knew about this years ago,lol! I will go with the enrolled options plan, TESC's website is somewhat confusing in outlining the differences and advantages.

Is there any advantage to picking up another Associates degree while completing my dual BA? Is there additional cost?

In the Enrolled Options Plan there is a blurb on TESC's website, "*Regardless of residence, full-time active duty military personnel have the option to pay New Jersey residency tuition." Does anyone know if this is inclusive of the Annual Enrollment Tuition Fee? Annual Enrollment Tuition for New Jersey residents* $1,691 Vs Out-of-state residents $3,154. That is a huge difference, I am hoping it includes both.

[Chicagoinvictus]

"No, they are different. A dual degree is what TESC calls "one bachelor's degree with two areas of study". TESC does not award two bachelor's degrees simultaneously; they can award one bachelor's degree and one associate's degree simultaneously. Two separate degrees would mean that you complete the BA in Social Science/History and CJ first and apply for graduation then only complete the second degree in BSBA General Management. However, you can start working on the second degree even before graduating with the first degree, as long as the date of completion (for those additional 24 credits in the second degree) recorded on the ACE transcript falls after the graduation date of your first degree. "

Will a grad school or prospective employer acknowledge the two areas of study the same way they would two degrees? The falling after the graduation date of my first degree hurts me a lot since I have done so many CLEP/DSST exams already. I am planning on getting my BSN in the next two years too. My community college courses consist of mainly the prerequisite for the BSN, A&P I & II, General Bio, Micro Bio, Intro Chem, General Chem, Stats, Nutrition, Medical Terminology, EMT-B and at least 35 hours of Criminal Justice/Law Enforcement courses.

I am basically transitioning careers from law enforcement to nursing. I am also finishing up my reservist career and looking into the possibilities of obtaining a commission.

[laughter]

Wow, Thank You once again! This blog is an invaluable source of information, much prompter and more efficient than the actual schools. I have made my mind up and will be attending TESC. I am submitting the application right now and will hopefully make contact with an advisor tomorrow. I am excited about this and very appreciative to those who have helped me gather the missing pieces. If only I knew about this years ago,lol! I will go with the enrolled options plan, TESC's website is somewhat confusing in outlining the differences and advantages. Does TESC offer a military tuition rate outside of the military degree completion plan? I would use it but I don't need nor want to complete 24 hours of residency since I am practically finished right now.

Is there any advantage to picking up another Associates degree while completing my dual BA? Is there additional cost?

Definitely! Sometimes I wished I'd discovered this forums earlier. :p

I'd let the military/tuition experts answer that question...

In terms of job application, it might add a "badge" to your transcript. Whether there's an additional cost depends on the credits you already have and the kind of associate's degree you wish to take. For an ASBA, you'd need another 12-15 credits.

A. Intellectual and Practical Skills 12
English Composition I & II - College Composition
College Algebra/Quantitative Business Analysis - ALEKS College Algebra $20 or Saylor's Beginning Algebra $25 (Perhaps Business Mathematics meets this requirement?)
Electives in Intellectual and Practical Skills - Technical Writing

B. Human Cultures and the Physical and Natural World 6
Macroeconomics (ECO-111) or Microeconomics (ECO-112) - Straighterline $49 plus enrollment
Humanities, Social Sciences or Natural Sciences elective - Natural Sciences

C. Personal and Social Responsibility 9 COMPLETED
Ethics Course - Business Ethics and Society
Diversity Course - Introduction to World Religions
Ethics or Diversity Elective - Ethics in America (Essay)

D. General Education Electives 3 COMPLETED
History of the US I

II. Management Core 18
A. Principles of Financial Accounting - Straighterline $49 plus enrollment
B. Principles of Managerial Accounting - Straighterline $49 plus enrollment
C. Business Law - Saylor Business Law and Ethics $25
D. Principles of Management - CLEP
E. Principles of Marketing - CLEP
F. Introduction to Computers/CIS - CLEP Information Systems & Computer Applications

III. Business Electives 6 COMPLETED
Human Resource Management
Organizational Behavior

IV. Free Electives 6 COMPLETED
Western Civilization I
Western Civilization II

Total 60

Just suggestions... some of them may be replaced with CLEP/DSST/TECEP/UExcel.

ALEKS College Algebra $20 (complete within one month)
Saylor Business Law and Ethics $25
Straighterline Macroeconomics/Microeconomics $49
StraighterlinePrinciples of Financial Accounting $49
StraighterlinePrinciples of Managerial Accounting $49
Straighterline one month enrollment fee - $99 (study required books before enrolling, then complete all quizzes and tests within 1 month)

SUB-TOTAL: $291
Apply code TESCS50 to get $50 off your first Straighterline course.
Apply SUM2014 to get $20 off your next Straighterline purchase (use during this summer).

TOTAL: $221 for 15 credits (price varies depending on what course/test you take and when you take it)\

The falling after the graduation date of my first degree hurts me a lot since I have done so many CLEP/DSST exams already. I am planning on getting my BSN in the next two years too. My community college courses consist of mainly the prerequisite for the BSN, A&P I & II, General Bio, Micro Bio, Intro Chem, General Chem, Stats, Nutrition, Medical Terminology, EMT-B and at least 35 hours of Criminal Justice/Law Enforcement courses.

Yeah, you would have to earn another 24 credits... but if you could find a way to utilize the TEEX, NFA, and Kaplan PLA credits, that'd give you 12 free credits.
TESC has a special BSN pathway for those who are taking it as a second degree. You could check that out.

[Chicagoinvictus]

Yah!!! Okay, I finalized and submitted my official application to TESC tonight. I actually completed the FAFSA and listed TESC in February 2014. I will fill out their financial aid form now. I electronically forwarded my JST/SMART transcript and I had my community college transcript sent in Feb2014. I hope they still have them and that I can get my application expedited, I am psyched to start and finish this badboy off!

I am somewhat familiar with Straighterline, I believe that is McGraw Hill? I am not familiar with Saylor, TEEX, NFA or Kaplan PLA. I know Kaplan does the review and study guides for tests but that's it. I have checked other posts on Straighterline, etc and I take it you have to setup an ACE account? How much does that cost and how long do they keep your grades? I am fortunate, in the fact that the military does this for us with CLEP,DSST,DOL, ACE accredited military courses and classes taken while on active-duty. The military's transcript is now called JST, formerly SMART for Navy/Marine Corps and it lasts for life.

If I get an Associates in Criminal Justice to accompany my dual major would that restrict me from using those CJ courses towards a future BA or Masters in CJ? I understand some of the principles but get confused on reusing courses that have been used for an existing degree. Can I use courses that I used in my current AGS towards my BA?

So, if I want to start work on a second BSBA degree, which I might as well do if I am paying for the Enrolled Tuition Option, I will have to wait until I am awarded my first degree or those courses will not be counted towards the second degree? That doesn't make sense to me, unless you would be using them towards your first BA.

Once again Thank you for your assistance and patience! I have been reading but am still in need of advice from the pro's.

[cathgrl]

At TESC you can only get two bachelor's degrees total (lifetime).
Most schools have this limit. If you're going for the BSN in the future and you're getting a BA, you can't also get a BSBA.

[soliloquy]

What Master's degree program were you thinking about?