Program to educate incarcerated people costs 40K per graduate?!

[studyingfortests]

I just read this article about a program to permit incarcerated people to earn college degrees.

It looks like an interesting program, but it has cost 800K for 20 inmates! 

It's surprising and a little disappointing that nobody has figured out that there are low cost and effective ways (especially with distance options) for people to earn degrees, especially when taxes are at least partially covering the cost.

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/news/l...660111002/

[rachel83az]

They may well be using CLEPs or something, not sure. Considering that a degree from Calvin University appears to cost $40k per YEAR, $40k per graduate isn't bad. https://calvin.edu/offices-services/fina...s/tuition/

Could be better, though.

[Jonathan Whatley]

Some learners and some subjects you can hand them a book or device, wait, assess, fairly easy.

Some will need more intensive help with coaching and motivation, accessibility and accommodations, literacy and conceptual understanding.

Related, if not directly an issue in the example in the OP, some students and their communities are going to be better served by something like a $50000 degree in an applied technology subject with practical experiential components that are inherently expensive to deliver than by a $5000 degree in general management or liberal studies.

[ss20ts]

This right here:

But half of the inmates who received four-year degrees have been sentenced to life behind bars and will never get out.

Why are taxpayers paying for degrees for people who will never leave a prison cell? Meanwhile people who haven't committed crimes are paying through the nose to get a college degree.


Wait a minute. It's $800K for 20 inmates PLUS the university gets their Pell Grants? Give me a break! 20 students for 6 sessions at UMPI a year is $168,000. Sounds like UMPI could cash in on inmates. WGU is around $160K a year for 20 people so they too could really cash in charging $800K plus the Pell Grants.

The seminary couldn't grant degrees, so it partnered with Calvin University. Anonymous donors along with federal Pell Grants fund the program, which costs $800,000 a year and enrolls 20 inmates annually.

[Jonathan Whatley]

Why are taxpayers paying for degrees for people who will never leave a prison cell?

Well, taxpayers are already paying something for non-credit library and activity programming for lifers. This program with degree credit attached is probably not the most expensive prison program. Maybe it'll be effective at its stated goal of improving behavior and conditions. Also, paroles and commutations happen.

Wait a minute. It's $800K for 20 inmates PLUS the university gets their Pell Grants? Give me a break! 20 students for 6 sessions at UMPI a year is $168,000. Sounds like UMPI could cash in on inmates. WGU is around $160K a year for 20 people so they too could really cash in charging $800K plus the Pell Grants.

To go from nothing to 20 students in your prison taking UMPI or WGU assessments all year, there's a good chance you'll have to add staff hours and technology to the library or computer lab. Heck, there's a good chance you'll have to add a computer lab that hadn't previously existed. And if you want the program to be successful for a good number of entrants, it may well take more direct and intensive learning coaching than WGU and UMPI do or can provide at a distance.

[MNomadic]

I believe Nations U offers their degrees for free to inmates. Granted, it's nationally accredited degree in religious topics but could be a great option for many inmates. There's also UofPeople which is VERY cheap(with tons of scholarships available to those in need). I'm 100% for helping inmates to return to society as productive citizens but I think there're more efficient ways to do that, even with mentors, tutors, etc. I'd rather educate 100s of inmates in general business, CS, and religious studies for the price that they're spending to educate only 20.

[Jonathan Whatley]

The savings could well be illusory if the state is paying less on the tuition budget line but more on library or activity budget lines, and the later often involving state workers with appropriate benefits and retirement. The savings could also be illusory if a cheaper per credit hour program has a much higher rate of students starting but not completing.

[ss20ts]

The savings could well be illusory if the state is paying less on the tuition budget line but more on library or activity budget lines, and the later often involving state workers with appropriate benefits and retirement. The savings could also be illusory if a cheaper per credit hour program has a much higher rate of students starting but not completing.

What library? Online programs utilize the online library from the college. Computer labs? 1 computer can be used by multiple people. It's not like they're spending 8 hours a day on their studies.

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Why are taxpayers paying for degrees for people who will never leave a prison cell?

Well, taxpayers are already paying something for non-credit library and activity programming for lifers. This program with degree credit attached is probably not the most expensive prison program. Maybe it'll be effective at its stated goal of improving behavior and conditions. Also, paroles and commutations happen.

Wait a minute. It's $800K for 20 inmates PLUS the university gets their Pell Grants? Give me a break! 20 students for 6 sessions at UMPI a year is $168,000. Sounds like UMPI could cash in on inmates. WGU is around $160K a year for 20 people so they too could really cash in charging $800K plus the Pell Grants.

To go from nothing to 20 students in your prison taking UMPI or WGU assessments all year, there's a good chance you'll have to add staff hours and technology to the library or computer lab. Heck, there's a good chance you'll have to add a computer lab that hadn't previously existed. And if you want the program to be successful for a good number of entrants, it may well take more direct and intensive learning coaching than WGU and UMPI do or can provide at a distance.

What library? Online programs have access to online libraries. Many prisons already have a computer lab no need for multiple computer labs.  The article said that half of those who earned a degree are sentenced to life and will never leave prison which means they're not eligible for parole. I highly doubt 10 of these students will be commutated. 

20 people can easily share multiple computers. The cost of a computer today is practically nothing. Definitely not anywhere near $40K. What makes you think Calvin University is providing "more direct and intensive learning coaching than WGU and UMPI do"? There are are many programs available today which are significantly less than $40K. U of the People is a few hundred dollars a semester. There are other colleges that have programs for prisoners and they aren't charging $40K per student. Calvin University is using this as a money grab to to the tune of $800K PLUS Pell Grants.

[Jonathan Whatley]

What library? Online programs have access to online libraries. Many prisons already have a computer lab no need for multiple computer labs.

20 people can easily share multiple computers. The cost of a computer today is practically nothing. Definitely not anywhere near $40K.

Staffing is the big cost area. If prisoners are going to have access to Internet searching and to prompt turnaround email correspondence, discussion boards, and instant messaging (e.g., for live chat with an online college librarian), in all but the most country-club minimum security environment, someone on or responsible to prison staff is needed to closely attend to their computer use and monitor their communication.

What makes you think Calvin University is providing "more direct and intensive learning coaching than WGU and UMPI do"?

The Calvin program sends professors and tutors to teach face-to-face on site in the prison. "Faculty from several colleges in West Michigan serve as professors in the program, and students from Calvin University are given the unique opportunity to tutor the inmates."

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The Detroit News article states the program "costs $800,000 a year and enrolls 20 inmates annually," and that this year's "ceremony recognized inmates who earned their degrees in 2020, 2021 and 2022."

It's very possible there's an entering cohort of 20 students per year but more than 20 students in the program at a time. That $800K might well be servicing 60 or 100 or more students making progress each year.

[LevelUP]

Staffing is the big cost area. If prisoners are going to have access to Internet searching and to prompt turnaround email correspondence, discussion boards, and instant messaging (e.g., for live chat with an online college librarian), in all but the most country-club minimum security environment, someone on or responsible to prison staff is needed to closely attend to their computer use and monitor their communication.

They can use DNS blocking to prevent users from visiting certain sites.

It would be cheap to hire someone in a 3rd world country to monitor their PCs remotely and use software that takes screenshots to monitor internet activity.

Computers are cheap, the Internet is cheap.  Financial aid the federal government pays for so who cares about that from a state level.

ACE credits someone needs to pay for and maybe up to a $5000 budget for a college degree beyond what financial aid pays.

GoFundMe or other private donations can help get these programs started if the state doesn't want to pay for the program.