Problem Using Excelsior College Degree Outside United States

[Law-Dude]

Has anybody here tried to use an Excelsior College credential outside of the United States? I'm in Canada and WES is the standard evaluator for foreign credentials. While they state that I have been awarded a Bachelor of Science, they do not transfer the GPA for what they deem to be "transfer" credits. They include the DSST and UExcel exams that I have as a letter grade on my Excelsior transcript as "transfer" credits and simply say they are a "Pass." So, my degree has a lower GPA in Canada than in the United States because my exam marks were on average higher than my coursework marks. My GPA in the eyes of an American school is 3.46, but my GPA in the eyes of a Canadian school is 3.0.

Has this happened to anyone else or am I the only one? Taking exams for which Excelsior awards a letter grade seems utterly useless for students who intend to go to graduate school outside of the United States unless they do not mind that grade being classified only as a "Pass."

[videogamesrock]

Isn't an 80% and higher an A in Canada except BC where it is an 85% and higher? If it is still like that I don't see why your GPA is lower in Canada.

[Law-Dude]

Isn't an 80% and higher an A in Canada except BC where it is an 85% and higher? If it is still like that I don't see why your GPA is lower in Canada.

My GPA is lower in Canada because my transcript has letter grades for DSST and UExcel exams in the United States, but only Pass/Fail grades when evaluated by the international credential evaluator used by Canadian universities. The universities here rely on WES to determine what the equivalent grades are; if Excelsior College transcribes a DSST exam as an "A" grade but WES converts it as a "Pass" grade, it is counted as a "Pass" grade by the Canadian university. A "Pass" has no associated GPA. If my average exam score is higher than my average coursework score, it means that not counting my exam scores towards my GPA will reduce my GPA.

To give an example:

If half of my degree's credits were from coursework in which I always received a C (GPA 2.0), and half of my degree's credits were from exams in which I always received an A (GPA 4.0), my cumulative GPA would be 3.0. However, the evaluation by WES would replace the exam half of my credits with a "Pass" grade instead of an "A" grade. That would mean my cumulative GPA, according to any school which uses the WES report instead of the original transcript, is only 2.0 instead of 3.0 because only the 2.0 scores were being counted.

In the United States, the WES report is not used. There, my CGPA would be 3.0.

In Canada, the WES report is used. There, my CGPA would be 2.0.

[SuzanneD]

Boo!
That would be disappointing.

[UptonSinclair]

My GPA is lower in Canada because my transcript has letter grades for DSST and UExcel exams in the United States, but only Pass/Fail grades when evaluated by the international credential evaluator used by Canadian universities. The universities here rely on WES to determine what the equivalent grades are; if Excelsior College transcribes a DSST exam as an "A" grade but WES converts it as a "Pass" grade, it is counted as a "Pass" grade by the Canadian university. A "Pass" has no associated GPA. If my average exam score is higher than my average coursework score, it means that not counting my exam scores towards my GPA will reduce my GPA.

To give an example:

If half of my degree's credits were from coursework in which I always received a C (GPA 2.0), and half of my degree's credits were from exams in which I always received an A (GPA 4.0), my cumulative GPA would be 3.0. However, the evaluation by WES would replace the exam half of my credits with a "Pass" grade instead of an "A" grade. That would mean my cumulative GPA, according to any school which uses the WES report instead of the original transcript, is only 2.0 instead of 3.0 because only the 2.0 scores were being counted.

In the United States, the WES report is not used. There, my CGPA would be 3.0.

In Canada, the WES report is used. There, my CGPA would be 2.0.

Have you applied to any graduate programs? If so, how did they view your Excelsior degree?

[bricabrac]

Forgive my ignorance but does any other school in the US actually award grades for the DSST exams?

I'm a TESC alumna and TECEPs were also only P/F as well as challenge exams I've taken at my community college. I always thought Excelsior was the only school who applied letter grades to these exams. I've heard of schools using the numerical values as a measure to award the credit but never to actually issue a letter grade. I hope I'm wording this correctly? Anyway, in my mind it would actually make more sense that any transcript auditor would follow the norm rather than the exception.(shrugs)

[Yanji]

Isn't an 80% and higher an A in Canada except BC where it is an 85% and higher? If it is still like that I don't see why your GPA is lower in Canada.

Getting an 80 in Canada is roughly equal to a 90 in the US due to less prevalent grade inflation and normalization. Regardless, there are different evaluation standards between American schools anyway, so an A is an A.

[Law-Dude]

Have you applied to any graduate programs? If so, how did they view your Excelsior degree?

I was accepted in and completed the distance-based graduate-entry LL.B. through the University of London International Programmes. I was also accepted into a couple different graduate law programmes in Canada. I don't think they care where the degree is from as long as it's accredited. They simply focus on GPA, LSAT scores, and extracurriculars (in Canada, anyway).

[Law-Dude]

Forgive my ignorance but does any other school in the US actually award grades for the DSST exams?

I'm a TESC alumna and TECEPs were also only P/F as well as challenge exams I've taken at my community college. I always thought Excelsior was the only school who applied letter grades to these exams. I've heard of schools using the numerical values as a measure to award the credit but never to actually issue a letter grade. I hope I'm wording this correctly? Anyway, in my mind it would actually make more sense that any transcript auditor would follow the norm rather than the exception.(shrugs)

I would think that if a regional accreditation body has approved a school's credit practices, those would be reflected in a transcript.

Regarding the UExcel exams, Canadian universities also usually have a challenge-for-credit option. They can have a Pass/Fail or letter grade system, and it varies by school and also by the faculty within the school or even by the course.

All of the Canadian university and college courses I've challenged so far, though, have had a letter grade. So, if you challenge the course in Canada, it will affect your GPA for the purpose of Canadian graduate school applications, but if you challenge it in the United States, it will not affect your GPA for the purpose of Canadian graduate school applications since the WES report will not count the letter grade.

[cookderosa]

The thing to remember, and it applies across the board, is that the school you are applying to can evaluate prior learning against any yardstick they want. This has always been true. In fact, they could disallow any credit by exam and just say "sorry, you'll need to complete these for a grade before you can apply here." (I can think of a dozen industries that want graded credit in specific courses) There seems to be a myth that "locking" credit up into a degree or transcript somehow makes it rock-solid, above refute; how many times a month does the question about credit laundering get asked? It's a common assumption. Unfortunately, that's just not the case. There are many examples of grad schools that pick apart your nice neat and tidy degree and reconfigure it to their standards. Anyone looking at professional doctorates is familiar with this practice; med schools don't allow grade replacement in GPA calculations (remember that F from 20 years ago? Yeah, it's in your GPA). Including every transcript for a GPA, calculating GPA for only science, transcribing pass/fail grades as 2.0 or C grades. It's really just their prerogative.

I can only think of 1 example of where a lower degree / transcript can trump a new application, and even that one example (articulation) is starting to be case-by-case and you can't really say that it's always true anymore. I spent an hour yesterday finding a bucket full of articulation exceptions in Virginia. It's really a process in looking at the end, and being diligent about working backwards. I get that it's sucky, but there are a zillion colleges on this planet, there's no reason to bang your head on the wall. Just keep looking for options. Also, i'd still suggest using DSST/CLEP. If you're headed down a road beyond your undergraduate degree, it's prudent to find the roadblocks that exist and deal with them sooner rather than later.

Nevertheless, I noticed you were accepted into multiple programs- CONGRATULATIONS!