Harvard Extension School Students Rally for Degree Name Change

[ss20ts]

I guess we are going to bring this topic back to life again.... Here we go.

Yawn..... This horse is so dead, it's decomposed and turned into dust.

[mcjon77]

For anyone who thinks that Harvard is going to change the name of the degree, just know that Extension School students have been complaining about it since AT LEAST as far back as when I took my first class there over 20 years ago. The HESA president was saying the exact same thing back then the the HESA president is saying now. The University showed no inclination to change the name then and no inclination to do so now.

If you don't like it there are now TONS of other universities to chose from that have online programs. This isn't meant to be an insult. It is just a request to explore your options.

[collegecareerstudent]

If you're going to drag me in this,  you might as well address me by name. Regardless of your thoughts and the degree name change, we know what we're up against. Why that means to not keep raising the issue is beyond me. They did actually block someone from running against the former president from saying they plan on changing the degree name because “The university is already on top of that" whatever that means. But yeah, we're aware of how long this fight has been going on. And I never promised personally to change the degree names and have 100% success。I'm not that egotistical. I promised to try. And I will and am.

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I'm sorry that you're bored but I thought the purpose of this thread was to continue to put updates on the progress regarding this issue. We are planning on doing some things during fall but of course there are things working against us. Still I thought the forum was excited about having someone here on the board giving you the ins and outs of how things work there. I'm literally moving halfway across the world in a few weeks to be there on campus and do what I can. What's dust to you is extremely important to me.

[ss20ts]

If you're going to drag me in this,  you might as well address me by name. Regardless of your thoughts and the degree name change, we know what we're up against. Why that means to not keep raising the issue is beyond me. They did actually block someone from running against the former president from saying they plan on changing the degree name because “The university is already on top of that" whatever that means. But yeah, we're aware of how long this fight has been going on. And I never promised personally to change the degree names and have 100% success。I'm not that egotistical. I promised to try. And I will and am.

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I'm sorry that you're bored but I thought the purpose of this thread was to continue to put updates on the progress regarding this issue. We are planning on doing some things during fall but of course there are things working against us. Still I thought the forum was excited about having someone here on the board giving you the ins and outs of how things work there. I'm literally moving halfway across the world in a few weeks to be there on campus and do what I can. What's dust to you is extremely important to me.

There's literally nothing different. There's no news to report. What's there to say? Students are still working on getting the name changed? Yeah, we got that. They've been trying for years. It's not going to happen. Harvard - like all of the Ivies - are stuck in their old fashioned 1700's mentality except for Cornell who's stuck in the 1800's.

[collegecareerstudent]

I agree that the powers that be have an old fashioned mentality. But, there's a lot different at the school in terms of content and the changing attitude toward HES- especially as enrollment continues to grow. Maybe not on the name front but certainly at the school. Nonetheless, students remain successful, and that's the most important thing. But any President that doesn't say the name can't be an issue and doesn't try to address it is probably missing a huge component of what the students care about and that's not something I recommend-especially during an election. The name WILL change, whether it's next year, ten years from now, or 100. It will. But the education machine takes as long as the justice system sometimes. It is what it is. But I'm not giving up. I intend to use the HES name proudly. There was nothing to be ashamed of, but I do have concerns that some of the students may not be able to market themselves or defend their choices as effectively- and I do agree they shouldn't have to. .

[mcjon77]

If you're going to drag me in this,  you might as well address me by name. Regardless of your thoughts and the degree name change, we know what we're up against. Why that means to not keep raising the issue is beyond me. They did actually block someone from running against the former president from saying they plan on changing the degree name because “The university is already on top of that" whatever that means. But yeah, we're aware of how long this fight has been going on. And I never promised personally to change the degree names and have 100% success。I'm not that egotistical. I promised to try. And I will and am.

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I'm sorry that you're bored but I thought the purpose of this thread was to continue to put updates on the progress regarding this issue. We are planning on doing some things during fall but of course there are things working against us. Still I thought the forum was excited about having someone here on the board giving you the ins and outs of how things work there. I'm literally moving halfway across the world in a few weeks to be there on campus and do what I can. What's dust to you is extremely important to me.

Dude, I don't know your name. Hell, did you even use your name on this board?  What is important is that you're the HESA president and you are saying the same thing that previous HESA presidents have said.

Additionally, your inference that I think you should stop fighting for this is mistaken. In fact, there's nothing in my post that says that you should stop fighting for this. What my post does say is that people been fighting for this for over 20 years and nothing's changed. What my post implied, with good reason, is that nothing's going to change in the near future.  I think it's perfectly fine and reasonable that you keep fighting for this.

My reason for the post is that I don't want anyone to get the impression that because the HESA president says that they are fighting for this issue that it is in any way likely it's such a name change will occur in the near future. I don't want anyone making any plans regarding attendance at HES based on them thinking that such a change is likely.

When I read your post, at first it seemed overly sensitive regarding any perceived criticism of this degree name change plan. Then I remembered back 10 to 12 years ago, when I was in the program and how sensitive I would get when anyone questioned HES, so I get it.  

In the 9 years since I graduated mellowed out regarding the degree name issue, in large part because it just hasn't been an issue for me. No one IRL ever said that I didn't go to the real Harvard or questioned my degree.  

If anything, the biggest limitation I've had with the degree name has been the fact that the major is information technology as opposed to computer science. The fact that it's a master of liberal arts and extension studies (which is how I put it on my resume) versus a master of science really hasn't been an issue for me.  Still, I have no problem with folks trying to change the degrees name.

[collegecareerstudent]

You did say the current president promised a name change. I didn't promise that. I also didn't campaign on that, either. I just want to clarify that. So, yes, I'd assume you would know my name if you're going to say I said something. I'd say it's logical to think that. And no, I don't use my actual name, but that hasn't stopped people from finding me, though I find that endearing and encouraging.

I didn't mean you specifically when I said people are suggesting I should stop fighting. When people are calling the comment thread dust and outright saying change isn't going to happen, it comes off as suggesting it's a moot point to even have the fight. That's where I disagree with several people. I'd say as an alum you have more sway than they do, but I just don't like the rhetoric that nothing will ever happen to make this better. Personally, I know what my degree name will say and I have accepted that, but I'm not fighting this fight for me.

You are correct in that HESA only has so much power. The Faculty of Arts and Sciences needs to put this on the agenda and they need to make the decision, but they haven't. I am going to have a push during fall semester when I move to Cambridge to try to stress the issue. Let me know if you want to be involved.

I waited 12 years before joining HES. During that time, I read up on these issues. So I'm not surprised, especially back then, but with the Crimson asking for change as well, and retracting their negative statements about HES, I really do feel the tide is turning. I just want people to care, because no President can bring forth the issue alone. We need support and numbers but with so many of us scattered all over the world, several students not knowing about HESA or having conflicting obligations, I sometimes, like prior presidents, feel like I'm screaming into a void.

I actually lost a 6 figure job over the naming issue and a Harvard College student sabotaging me, and another student just got an offer rescinded because of an employer's interpretation of the value of an HES degree, so it's a mixed bag. I'm delighted you haven't had a negative experience like that.

I do think if nothing else- allowing for IT degrees to be Master of Science except Liberal Arts is a good start in the right direction.

[mcjon77]

You did say the current president promised a name change. I didn't promise that.

Please show me in my posts exactly where I wrote that you promised a name change because I do not see it.

[collegecareerstudent]

"The HESA president was saying the exact same thing back then the the HESA president is saying now. The University showed no inclination to change the name then and no inclination to do so now."- To any outside reader that would suggest your comment about the presidents is related to the name. I have said nothing officially on the record about degree changes and while I have immense respect for the former presidents, we are different people with different approaches. If that's not what you meant, then I appreciate the clarification.

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You know what, I'm going to retract my statement and apologize, because you didn't explicitly say that now that I'm reading it again and looking from your perspective. That's a logical fallacy on my part because I know what some HESA presidents have promised in the past as part of their campaigns, and several of their competitors have as well that they will have the degree name changed. I don't know what the HESA president was saying then and I don't think our archives go that far back. However, I don't think it's fair to say the former president from 20 years ago is saying the same things the president is saying now. I'm the current President and I haven't said anything yet. I'm really cautious about how I appear next to other former presidents and how I'm associated with them. I ran my platform on serving the students and that was it. I'm watching and observing before I make any formal statements. I've also added on LinkedIn and talked to or am associated with several former presidents so I wouldn't go as far as to say the Presidents are/were all saying the same things. I hope that's clear. My bad for that.

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Back to what I was saying, though, there are mixed views about Harvard Extension on this forum and on this thread, and the comments on the value of the degree in general, and the degree name. That doesn't mean the issue doesn't matter and that we should give up or that it's a pointless fight. It's easy to think things will never change- but I think there's a good chance they can and will. It starts with attitudes, and then engagement, and so on. There are some wonderful things happening- like the current Harvard Graduate Council president being the first from HES. I would like to hope people would do their research before engaging in any degree program to understand all of the possible implications. By all means, if someone doesn't like the HES naming convention, they have every right to pass that opportunity up. The problem is HES doesn't listen to non-students and if you want to inspire a change- any change-, you have to go there (attend) and you have to do something about it yourself, otherwise it really is impossible. I won't lie- progress is slow, but I promise you there has been progress.

[bluebooger]

unsubscribing from this garbage thread