Feedback on potential plan

[xBless]

Hi,

Your Location: FL
Your Age: 28
What kind of degree do you want?: PhD Psychology
Current Regional Accredited Credits: 75
Current ACE, CLEP, or NCCRS Credits: 18
Any certifications or military experience?: 0
Budget: Willing to go in debt.
Commitments: I have a lady and family to consider, but I've given them so much positive equity in relational love that they can take a hit.
Dedicated time to study: 60hr/week is probably my burnout.
Timeline: Dec 1. is PhD early app deadline. This year or next year. (If MA needed for app improvement) Maybe I slide in with a strong personal statement.
Tuition assistance/reimbursement: Pell, I have no income currently.

[For the BA Psych] I posted last September where I was given great advice and attended UMPI--thank you again, it's been an excellent fit and experience. Most of the information above is the same as it was then. I'll need another 5 courses at UMPI and 4 that I'm testing out of. This is already nearly completely set in stone with no feedback needed.

I can see the completion of the BA, and it looks like that'll happen sometime this summer. As I mentioned in September, I have attempted applications with PhD programs based on a strong personal statement (and minimal supporting evidence), but it's unlikely to be strong enough. With that, I've been considering what to do until Fall 2026 (given I'm unlikely to get in Fall 2025). This leaves me with just about 12-14months.

I'm still aiming at the PhD and considering how I can transfer a master's over. I've looked at some schools offering APA accredited PhD programs and their transfer requirements. I've been considering UWA MS Experimental Psychology (with the master's thesis) as a stepping stone into a PhD program in Clinical Psychology or something similar. I've compared UWA's curriculum to UF and it seems like a good match. I haven't seen many options for completing a masters + master's thesis with similar curriculum in this time frame, but I was wondering if I'm overlooking something (like with UMPI).

I've been doing my thing since that last post and I hope you guys have been, too. I had two years left at the beginning of this and it looks like I'll have it done in about 10 months with a 4.0. It was more than I could have hoped for going in--I was debating prioritizing a masters or a 4.0, but it looks like I can have it all. I certainly wouldn't be in a position this well had I not learned so much from this forum and had I not had some guidance. I'm very grateful. I've consistently been at burnout throughout these months, but at the same time I think I can maintain this pace for a bit longer.

Financials are of concern [UWA will likely be ~15-20k] and I could work over the next year instead, but I would expect that it would actually be more economical to potentially cut ~2years from the PhD program. All thoughts are appreciated. Bless.

[Heartstrings]

I currently live in Texas and worked in counseling/human services for a few decades. I am not sure about Florida but here, LPC's, Social Worker's, Marriage and Family Therapists, & Psychologists all compete for the same jobs. Every field has a different way of looking at the clien't issues. The pay is crappy and to be honest not worth going into massive debt. The ROI is not worth it. I know a lot states do not require APA for licensure but federal jobs I believe do require it or at least if you're applying for internships. This professor that taught at an APA accredited school once told me it is harder to get into an APA accredited psych program than it is to get into medical school. Take what you will.

Edit: I wanted add I am member of APA and I read that they are trying to bring more master level psychologists to more states because other professions are competing like LPC LMFT, Social Work. They all pretty much do the same job.

Edit 2: https://www.apa.org/monitor/2025/01/tren...fessionals Wanted to include the link for the APA article

[Hotdogman1]

When you mentioned applying for PhD programs without a bachelor's, I assumed the difficulty was comparable to gaining admission to a lower-tier online MBA program.  "The Department of Psychology typically receives over 350 applications annually for our Ph.D. programs. The incoming class each year ranges from 15 to 25 students" (https://psych.ufl.edu/graduate/prospecti...dmissions/). That means the UFlorida PSY PHD program has a ~4-7% admission rate...isn't that like applying for med school with only a personal statement?

Anyways, I looked into UF so you should research the specifics for each program you're interested in. UF has this nifty PPT where they break down how much time they review each component of your application folder. Due to the high number of applicants, they dedicate about 15 minutes per folder. While it's not concrete, I think it gives a basic indication on what weight they put on each component of your application:

• (2 min = subjective 13.34%) Transcript, GPA, and relevant coursework
  
• (3 min = subjective 20%) Personal Statement
  
• (6 min = subjective 40%) 3 Letters of recommendation
  
• (2 min = subjective 13.34%) Resume
  
• (2 min = subjective 13.34%) Application & GRE score
  

You shouldn't assume that the personal statement and letters are more important than the other components with this information, but rather that they can hold significant importance.

From how it's written in the PSY PHD handbook, it seems like they either fully accept the masters or they don't accept it at all:
"a) The Master’s Degree is fully accepted by the Supervisory Committee and the student proceeds directly to the Ph.D., completing any remaining required coursework, the qualifying examination and the dissertation.
Or: b) The Master’s Degree is not accepted by the Supervisory Committee. In this case, the student will be required to complete a Master’s Degree in our program or meet the Research Requirement as explained above in Sections II. A and B respectively" (https://psych.ufl.edu/wp-content/uploads...onsF14.pdf )

You can't really call UF and guarantee anything since the Supervisory committee is formed after you become a student. You could contact your preferred advisors and ask their opinion about the program but they would be one member of the committee. The UWA program also looks to be an online non APA/CACREP program but I don't know how much weight that would be given. Overall, it seems like the best strategy is meet all the required/recommended requirements with the bachelor's and treat the masters as a "cherry on top". 

• GPA, and relevant coursework - 4.0 GPA for the UMPI PSY BA is great. I can't tell if the PSY program satisfies the core course requirement (since they don't provide a specific list). While UMPI PSY coursework should satisfy the recommended requirements a History and Systems of Psychology, Statistics (e.g., multiple regression), and Research methods and design courses, it doesn't satisfy "Life-science (e.g., biology, chemistry, physics, health science)."
  
• Research experience - While under "Recommended Experience", it includes the word "minimum": "A minimum of 1-2 semesters as a research assistant in a laboratory conducting psychological research. Publications or presentations of research serve as evidence of the quality of the applicant’s work." I guess you could try contacting local professors or applying at an external position, but I assume they would prioritize their own students.
  

• Relevant volunteer/work experience - The UMPI program does have an optional practicum (optional if you take psy 360 and psy 448 at UMPI). Even if you do the practicum, you will need more to stand out.
  
• Match between student and professor - "Prospective students are strongly encouraged to contact area directors and individual faculty members regarding their research interests and to ascertain if that faculty member will be admitting new students to her/his research group. Our Psychology program operates on a mentor-mentee model." (https://psych.ufl.edu/graduate/prospecti...dmissions/)
  
• GRE scores are not required and it seems like they are treated more as a "cherry on top"
  

Questions:
Does the UMPI coursework satisfy the required core courses? (I don't know who you would ask, a UF advisor or registrar maybe?)
Who are you going to ask for letters of recommendation? Yourpace probably one of the worst formats to get good letters since you barely interact with the professors.
When are you going to do work/research experience?
Are you going to do the life science courses? You should be able to do it online since it's only recommended and they already accept online PSY bachelor's.
If you do decide to do the UWA program, when are you going to take the GRE (required for admission)?

I'm not a psychologist nor plan on doing a PSY PHD, but it seems like you should slow down. You are utilizing Pell Grant and have in-state tuition in Florida (lucky). You could take pause UMPI and:

• transfer to any in state local public 4 year university, enroll in life science courses, apply for a internal university research assistant positions and as external candidates (eg research hospitals), work for a year (3 semesters), get 3-4 candidates for letters, and transfer back to UMPI (1-2 more letters if possible.) and graduate.
  
• transfer to any in state local community college, enroll in life science courses, apply for research assistant positions and utilize the CC's work center/fair, work for a year, get 3-4 candidates for letters, and transfer back to UMPI (1-2 more letters if possible.) and graduate.
  
• apply for research assistant positions at a "laboratory conducting psychological research", work for a year then graduate from UMPI (3-4 letters. Maybe look into whether any school in the University of Maine system has any remote research assistant positions available).
  

[xBless]

When you mentioned applying for PhD programs without a bachelor's, I assumed the difficulty was comparable to gaining admission to a lower-tier online MBA program.  "The Department of Psychology typically receives over 350 applications annually for our Ph.D. programs. The incoming class each year ranges from 15 to 25 students" (https://psych.ufl.edu/graduate/prospecti...dmissions/). That means the UFlorida PSY PHD program has a ~4-7% admission rate...isn't that like applying for med school with only a personal statement?

Anyways, I looked into UF so you should research the specifics for each program you're interested in. UF has this nifty PPT where they break down how much time they review each component of your application folder. Due to the high number of applicants, they dedicate about 15 minutes per folder. While it's not concrete, I think it gives a basic indication on what weight they put on each component of your application:

• (2 min = subjective 13.34%) Transcript, GPA, and relevant coursework
  
• (3 min = subjective 20%) Personal Statement
  
• (6 min = subjective 40%) 3 Letters of recommendation
  
• (2 min = subjective 13.34%) Resume
  
• (2 min = subjective 13.34%) Application & GRE score
  

You shouldn't assume that the personal statement and letters are more important than the other components with this information, but rather that they can hold significant importance.

From how it's written in the PSY PHD handbook, it seems like they either fully accept the masters or they don't accept it at all:
"a) The Master’s Degree is fully accepted by the Supervisory Committee and the student proceeds directly to the Ph.D., completing any remaining required coursework, the qualifying examination and the dissertation.
Or: b) The Master’s Degree is not accepted by the Supervisory Committee. In this case, the student will be required to complete a Master’s Degree in our program or meet the Research Requirement as explained above in Sections II. A and B respectively" (https://psych.ufl.edu/wp-content/uploads...onsF14.pdf )

You can't really call UF and guarantee anything since the Supervisory committee is formed after you become a student. You could contact your preferred advisors and ask their opinion about the program but they would be one member of the committee. The UWA program also looks to be an online non APA/CACREP program but I don't know how much weight that would be given. Overall, it seems like the best strategy is meet all the required/recommended requirements with the bachelor's and treat the masters as a "cherry on top". 

• GPA, and relevant coursework - 4.0 GPA for the UMPI PSY BA is great. I can't tell if the PSY program satisfies the core course requirement (since they don't provide a specific list). While UMPI PSY coursework should satisfy the recommended requirements a History and Systems of Psychology, Statistics (e.g., multiple regression), and Research methods and design courses, it doesn't satisfy "Life-science (e.g., biology, chemistry, physics, health science)."
  
• Research experience - While under "Recommended Experience", it includes the word "minimum": "A minimum of 1-2 semesters as a research assistant in a laboratory conducting psychological research. Publications or presentations of research serve as evidence of the quality of the applicant’s work." I guess you could try contacting local professors or applying at an external position, but I assume they would prioritize their own students.
  

• Relevant volunteer/work experience - The UMPI program does have an optional practicum (optional if you take psy 360 and psy 448 at UMPI). Even if you do the practicum, you will need more to stand out.
  
• Match between student and professor - "Prospective students are strongly encouraged to contact area directors and individual faculty members regarding their research interests and to ascertain if that faculty member will be admitting new students to her/his research group. Our Psychology program operates on a mentor-mentee model." (https://psych.ufl.edu/graduate/prospecti...dmissions/)
  
• GRE scores are not required and it seems like they are treated more as a "cherry on top"
  

Questions:
Does the UMPI coursework satisfy the required core courses? (I don't know who you would ask, a UF advisor or registrar maybe?)
Who are you going to ask for letters of recommendation? Yourpace probably one of the worst formats to get good letters since you barely interact with the professors.
When are you going to do work/research experience?
Are you going to do the life science courses? You should be able to do it online since it's only recommended and they already accept online PSY bachelor's.
If you do decide to do the UWA program, when are you going to take the GRE (required for admission)?

I'm not a psychologist nor plan on doing a PSY PHD, but it seems like you should slow down. You are utilizing Pell Grant and have in-state tuition in Florida (lucky). You could take pause UMPI and:

• transfer to any in state local public 4 year university, enroll in life science courses, apply for a internal university research assistant positions and as external candidates (eg research hospitals), work for a year (3 semesters), get 3-4 candidates for letters, and transfer back to UMPI (1-2 more letters if possible.) and graduate.
  
• transfer to any in state local community college, enroll in life science courses, apply for research assistant positions and utilize the CC's work center/fair, work for a year, get 3-4 candidates for letters, and transfer back to UMPI (1-2 more letters if possible.) and graduate.
  
• apply for research assistant positions at a "laboratory conducting psychological research", work for a year then graduate from UMPI (3-4 letters. Maybe look into whether any school in the University of Maine system has any remote research assistant positions available).
  

First of all, thank you for the time you took in writing this--I appreciate you. I hear a lot of your concerns. I've actually just finished Biology, Drugs & Behavior (which is biology heavy) and Psychobiology. In terms of statistics and research, Research Methods II isn't available for Yourpace students (and this is slightly concerning). Beyond this, the curriculum has felt sufficient, but I wouldn't know with certainty. I've lived in FL for under a year, actually--combined with me only needing a single additional semester, I think there would be little value in switching paths at this point. The applications I submitted to graduate school while ~30+ cr off of a BA was bold to say the least. That said, I still wouldn't be very surprised if it landed me somewhere. By the time of my next applications, if it's meant to be what I'm doing with my life, I'll be there.

Your Qs:

1. It does seem like UMPI satisfies nearly all coursework. (Research Methods II lacking)
   
2. Recommendations letters, I'd requested 2 the first time of apps, and have another 2 professors who've accepted to write them. One of these professors I'll be meeting with this week to discuss some of these things and recommendations for moving forward.
   
3. I was thinking of doing this through the MA program. This is my primary question, really. I'll have 12-14 months or so before Fall 2026. How do I make the most of this? UWA seems like a strong choice to me... assuming a school like UF (I'd go to others) would accept the Masters + thesis. My other options during this time would be looking for research assistant positions or other work in the field... but these opportunities seem few, or nearly nonexistent. 
   
4. I think the life science courses are taken care of. I do have another class or two of wiggle room that I could use to supplement UF's requirements, which I hadn't considered--so I will thanks to you. 
   
5. That GRE... I would need to take it very soon. I'm thinking of calling UWA this morning to talk with them about my goals. 
   

Also, graduate programs write their ideal. In some ways, they're settling with nearly every (if not every) candidate they're taking. Honestly it's just a matter of being liked by them and checking the boxes. I let all of that stress of perfection fall right off of me. Ain't going to get it done that way. 

Again, I appreciate your words, and I'm glad to see that UWA doesn't seem to be the worst option in terms of accreditation. I know I've been bold and novice in my applications up to this point, and I'm glad you guys can laugh with me about it--as they can. The application included... the first half-semester of work at UMPI, 2 As, a recommendation letter, Associate's degree+test out credits... just to support the claim that I'd be done in time. It wasn't just a recommendation letter, but it definitely was the most important part given that even if they wanted to take me, it might not be wise on the surface.

Honestly, though, it's just a matter of time, and I'm looking to take the most efficient steps forward.

---

I currently live in Texas and worked in counseling/human services for a few decades. I am not sure about Florida but here, LPC's, Social Worker's, Marriage and Family Therapists, & Psychologists all compete for the same jobs. Every field has a different way of looking at the clien't issues. The pay is crappy and to be honest not worth going into massive debt. The ROI is not worth it. I know a lot states do not require APA for licensure but federal jobs I believe do require it or at least if you're applying for internships. This professor that taught at an APA accredited school once told me it is harder to get into an APA accredited psych program than it is to get into medical school. Take what you will.

Edit: I wanted add I am member of APA and I read that they are trying to bring more master level psychologists to more states because other professions are competing like LPC LMFT, Social Work. They all pretty much do the same job.

Edit 2: https://www.apa.org/monitor/2025/01/tren...fessionals Wanted to include the link for the APA article

I won't abandon the dream! I don't even exactly know why. It feels fun to chase something.

[bjcheung77]

Basically, complete the Bachelors first, move up to the Masters afterwards, then investigate the doctoral level of studies when you have the time and are closer to finishing the Masters... It's great to plan ahead, it depends on how far ahead you are planning. I would keep it simple, you can't open the second door when the first one isn't open yet. If I was in your shoes and wanted something similar, I would do something like this, UMPI BA Psych, Walden MS Psych, Kairos Doctorate.

[Hotdogman1]

It was my understanding that it's more common to directly enroll into a PSY PhD with a Bachelor's (getting the masters through the PHD). Did you ask an PhD admissions advisor if a master's degree would improve your application? If so, what can you do with a UWA masters if you fail to get into a PHD? Would it meet LPC requirements in your state? What PSY PhD programs have UWA graduates been able to transfer into? What master's degrees has precedence for transferring into PhD programs and which PhD programs were they?

I find it jarring to be rushing into so much debt without extensive research and multiple backup plans. If you have 14 months of wait time, does nothing in the undergrad level interest you at all? You still have Pell Grant that you could be maximizing. You could add another major at UMPI as backup/combo: health administration might be a good combo, business admin could also be a good fallback. If not, maybe consider completing the additional courses for the Mental Health Rehabilitation Technician/Community Certification (MHRT/C) and utilize it to find jobs for relevant work experience.

[bjcheung77]

Here's an example from an institution mentioned on this and the sister board - CSU, they offer the DBA and PsyD, the requirement is to go from Bachelors, Masters, Doctorate. All institutions are going to be different, some will require a logical progression, some would allow you to complete the doctorate and the first two years would be the Masters (this is very similar to what UK and other country policies are like). Link: https://calsouthern.smartcatalogiq.com/e...l-degrees/

[eLearner]

Basically, complete the Bachelors first, move up to the Masters afterwards, then investigate the doctoral level of studies when you have the time and are closer to finishing the Masters... It's great to plan ahead, it depends on how far ahead you are planning.  I would keep it simple, you can't open the second door when the first one isn't open yet.  If I was in your shoes and wanted something similar, I would do something like this, UMPI BA Psych, Walden MS Psych, Kairos Doctorate.

It's important to note that to enter a DPC program like the one at Kairos, it requires you to already be a licensed Professional Counselor with post-Master's experience.

Also, if one wants get licensed as a Doctor of Psychology, it's near impossible to do so without taking an APA accredited Doctoral program which California Southern University is not. If the program is approved in a student's state, then there is at least a shot, but still difficult to do.

[Jonathan Whatley]

And although Walden and Capella have license-eligible mental health programs at the master's level, their CBE subscription-priced master's in psychology are decidedly not license-eligible.