Are there Degree Planning Consultants?

[rachel83az]

Hello Rachel, so forgive me in advance if I repeat a few questions, as I mentioned before I have tried this a few times and ended up lost, spending time and money I did not need to spend is seems.

My priorities are as follows.
1) Fastest path to a bachelor's degree (self study,....the least challenging testing/learning experience.. is CLEP is harder to navigate than study.com, etc..)
1a) as little math as possible
2) I Don't do well with "here is a book read it and 6 weeks later proctored exam", I do better will chapter based courses with knowledge checks along the way and and a summary exam at the end.
3) I don't care what the degree is in.
4) Credit for prior experience?
5) Money

Can you help me understand:
Charter Oak is a long-time favorite due to its low cost. But it has a number of significant drawbacks. 

What are the drawbacks?

TESU is the most expensive, but they offer degrees you can't easily get elsewhere (such as math). 
Based on my use case does TESU fit?

Excelsior is in the middle as far as cost goes but they also have a few downsides. 

What are the downsides?

UMPI is 100% the most straightforward approach, but some people don't like the idea of competency-based degrees.

What are competency based degrees, how does this differ from the above mentioned institutions?

I read pell grants are a consideration?

Some schools have a flat rate program?

Some platforms have exams that are more easily passable based on prior knowledge? (I've heard this about so CLEP exam's)

There are repositories for credits?

Is these a matrix I can use to map out what credit I need to get, where I can get them and difficult of the platform?

Thanks!

1. Based on #2, CLEP is not appropriate for your needs. It is very much "read this and then take an exam". 1a. You MUST have some math but Sophia algebra and/or stats aren't bad. CSM Learn is also a possibility for TESU or EC (Excelsior) students. 
   
2. Based on this, you would not like: Davar, Coopersmith, CLEP, or DSSTs. You also will not like TECEPs or UExcels. There may be no way around taking some of these things, but at least you can (mostly) avoid them. You will like Sophia, Study.com, and StraighterLine. For RA credit, if needed, ONU, TEL, and ASU are also good options. None of these are "read a book and then EXAM". 
   
3. Liberal Studies will allow you the most freedom here. You can take courses in "anything" and get your degree (subject to degree requirements). This also tends to be the most affordable.
   
4. This is way too expensive, compared to alt credit sources, and not advised. Especially when getting a liberal studies degree, it is easiest to find an alt credit course that most matches your experience(s) and take that for credit. What prior experience(s) would you hope to get credit for?
   
5. Approximately how much money are you hoping to spend? There is a wide range of options. All-in, you're looking at somewhere between around $5000 and $9000 for a liberal studies degree. At the low end is COSC and UMPI. At the high end is TESU. EC is soundly in the middle.
   

• Charter Oak drawbacks: You must have 30 upper-level credits; not everyone wants to do the extra coursework for this. They also require a total of 30 RA credits. This adds about $2000 to the cost of their degree. Finally, they recently changed policies so that they only accept a very limited range of alternate credit options. For instance, you cannot use CSM Learn as a math option to get your degree. This completely eliminates them as an option for some people. It could still be in the running for you because Sophia Algebra is accepted and really isn't that bad as long as you only hate math and don't have something like dyscalculia.
  
• TESU: Possibly. Like COSC, they require a total of 30 RA credits. They do accept CSM Learn (so they are very low-math) and they only require 15 UL credits to complete a BALS (liberal studies) degree. They do cost around $9000 (counting all tuition, fees, Study.com, Sophia, etc.) but some people feel it's worth it to not have to complete 30 UL credits. 
  
• Excelsior: Excelsior does NOT require 30 RA credits, so this helps keep their cost lower. But they do still require 30 UL credits. With EC, this can be difficult to accomplish solely with Study.com, so students may have to complete courses at Coopersmith. As previously mentioned, Coopersmith is very much "here is the book, come back when you want to test". 
  
• UMPI: You pay a flat rate ($1400/term which works out to $700/mo) for as many courses as you are able to complete within that period. If you check the UMPI section, it's not unusual for students to complete 4 or 5 courses during a term. This can work out to somewhere between $100 and $200 per credit, which is pretty amazing for college credits considering that you do NOT have to purchase any textbooks. Everything is included in that price. A bit more information about competency-based degrees is available at https://degreeforum.miraheze.org/wiki/Co...d_Programs UMPI does require 30 UL credits, but because you would be taking them all at UMPI this would be a much simpler approach than either COSC or EC.
  
• Pell Grants: They can be a consideration, yes. Not everyone is eligible for a full Pell Grant. If you do qualify for a full Pell Grant, the total out-of-pocket spend for TESU could be under $5k. https://www.degreeforum.net/mybb/Thread-...ng-Courses 
  
• Flat-rate: TESU does this if you take 9 or more credits in a single term. Depending on what you're doing, it's not always a substantial savings. UMPI has a much more affordable flat-rate option in the form of their competency-based degrees.
  
• Prior knowledge: Addressed above. This really depends on what prior knowledge you're attempting to bring to the table.
  
• Credit repositories: Let's not tackle this yet. tldr: Yes, kind of, but you don't have to pay for it. It's irrelevant at this stage of the game.
  
• Matrix: You need to choose a school first before you can start making a degree plan beyond "Sophia". If you do it the other way around, you may wind up duplicating credits and nobody wants to do that. If you choose TESU, you can start making a plan based on https://degreeforum.miraheze.org/wiki/Sa...ts_Roadmap There is a similar (though less complete) plan for COSC here: https://degreeforum.miraheze.org/wiki/Sa...ts_Roadmap so you can start to make comparisons. There is not one for Excelsior at this point in time. UMPI does not need such a plan but there is some more information about the school and the recommended path here: https://degreeforum.miraheze.org/wiki/Un...esque_Isle
  

[dfrecore]

• Charter Oak drawbacks: For instance, you cannot use CSM Learn as a math option to get your degree. This completely eliminates them as an option for some people. It could still be in the running for you because Sophia Algebra is accepted and really isn't that bad as long as you only hate math and don't have something like dyscalculia.
  

Dumb question here - why do you list College Algebra and Stats as the only options for math at COSC?  There are lots of other math courses they will take, including Study.com's MAT 102: College Mathematics or MAT 107: Quantitative Literacy; the College Math CLEP; Contemporary UExcel; Fundamentals of College Algebra or Math for Liberal Arts DSST's; Intermediate Algebra from a CC; Quantitative Analysis I from TEL; MTH 117 - Finite Math from ONU; etc.  LOTS of options other than Sophia.

[rachel83az]

• Charter Oak drawbacks: For instance, you cannot use CSM Learn as a math option to get your degree. This completely eliminates them as an option for some people. It could still be in the running for you because Sophia Algebra is accepted and really isn't that bad as long as you only hate math and don't have something like dyscalculia.
  

Dumb question here - why do you list College Algebra and Stats as the only options for math at COSC?  There are lots of other math courses they will take, including Study.com's MAT 102: College Mathematics or MAT 107: Quantitative Literacy; the College Math CLEP; Contemporary UExcel; Fundamentals of College Algebra or Math for Liberal Arts DSST's; Intermediate Algebra from a CC; Quantitative Analysis I from TEL; MTH 117 - Finite Math from ONU; etc.  LOTS of options other than Sophia.

Because Sophia's Algebra is literally the cheapest, fastest, and arguably easiest way to meet the math requirement. OP does not want exams (which rules out CLEP, UExcel, or DSST). Sophia is open-book for its Milestones & Challenges (quizzes & exams), which Study.com is not, and that makes Sophia a bit easier. ONU, TEL, and CCs are all full math courses and not really what I would consider "low" in math. So, yes, there are a wide variety of options for math but, based on OP's preferences, that severely limits the possibilities.

[thecontrarian]

I started another thread here on a BS in Accounting with an ultimate objective to become a CPA. Personally, I've got huge value from the responses here. Initially, none of it seemed to make any sense but everyone's been so patient explaining the basics. This forum has opened up an option for me (college) that I thought was closed off. I'm graduating HS with 5 APs, 4.0 GPA and over1450 SAT, but zero financial aid or scholarships. Regardless of what the government thinks, I just couldn't justify an ROI on $150K of college cost. Perhaps I'm looking at it too short term. IDK. Either way, thanks to this forum I've found a new way to get to the same destination and I'm going to take it.

I owe a debt here to people that I likely can never payback.

[bjcheung77]

@thecontrarian - just wondering if you had some time to answer an inquiry to your scholarship search on your original thread here: https://www.degreeforum.net/mybb/Thread-...ing?page=3

[thecontrarian]

@thecontrarian - just wondering if you had some time to answer an inquiry to your scholarship search on your original thread here: https://www.degreeforum.net/mybb/Thread-...ing?page=3

@bjcheung77 

Saw that, but just got no response. I didn't just have a 98th percentile SAT, I also had a 4.0 GPA and some very solid extracurriculars as well as volunteering for over 5 years. My AP's were maxed out, I could have done no more AP just from a personal perspective. 

The Ivy thing was just a gamble anyway, I didn't expect anything. I understand lots of kids go in there with 1600 SAT and get rejected. That's fine. But I didn't even really manage to get into the next tier below Ivy's!!! LOL. 

I did end up getting an offer from my state college and some merit scholarship there, but fairly minor $$$. FAFSA determined my parents have to make the full contribution. In the end, I was looking at $150K to pay myself + loans etc. 

Is that worth $150K to go to a mid-tier college? Maybe for some but for me, the ROI wasn't there.  

I'm cool with it. One door closed another opened. I'm still positive about it.

[RICKE95126]

So I dug out my transcripts, and I have more credits than I thought, but I don't know which will be useful. 

I am guessing the .50 credit classes are not going to be of much use:
What about the PE credits? 

My Goal The fastest, cheapest 4-year degree with the option of going MBA at some point. 

The least amount of math and science possible 

I have read this about Competency-Based Degrees. Is this a fair assessment? 

If so, this sounds good for my situation. Is this route more expensive, more restrictive regarding transferring credit, and which platforms can I use? 

Can you help me with a degree plan and which platforms I should explore? 

Any Financial aid options I should consider (No $ from employer.... I am the employer

My credits: 

California 4 year CC  

Coun 100 Orintatation to college .50 P 
PE 010 Sports Conditioning .50 C
BSOP  100 Open Typewrtting Lab .50 P
ICS 011 Roots of Afro Amer Cult 4.00 C
PE 040 Intercollegiate Football 3.00 A

WSC (MA 4 year State University) 


HI111   US HISTORY 1 3.00  C
PE175   Princleces of Coaching 3.00 D+
PS 110  Gen PSY I 3.00 C
MA7100 Basic Mathematics 3.00 B
EN7101 English Comp I 3.00 C+

[bjcheung77]

Interesting turn of events, more credits for a slight win! Ya, that's great! Depending on how much you make yearly - You might want to apply for financial aid, if you get the most out of Pell Grant, take 16-18 credits at the college/university of your choice. I am vouching for the Big 3, so you can transfer in the bulk of your credits as they only require 6 credits for COSC/TESU or 7 for Excelsior - 113/114 can be transferred in!

Having said that, competency based degree programs may be cheaper/easier/faster "IF" you have the energy/time to complete the courses "AND" know the subject material really well, otherwise, it will drag on and you pay for each session/term you're enrolled in. If you are starting off with just 20-25 RA credits, you can transfer in 90 alternative credits from multiple ACE sources - UMPI is one of them that recently allowed this, previously, it was set to 30 alternative credits.

Pick a Big 3 or CBE program and school, it won't really matter if you don't know which one yet, apply to them all for the ones with the FREE applications, you just pay for transcripts. Find the one with the most transfer of your credits and path with least resistance to finish (TESU is my choice and there are many reasons over CBE/COSC/Excelsior). You need to get all your gen ed/free electives anyways, get them through Sophia.org, for UL do Study.com.

[rachel83az]

Okay, so, assuming that all of the credits are accepted, you have 23.5 RA credits. You really just need 1 more credit to be good to go for either TESU or COSC. You have a few different choices here: 

1. English Composition II TECEP for $150. Despite your dislike of one-and-done exams, this is arguably the easiest way to get the English Comp credit necessary. 
   
2. College Readiness at TEL - 1 credit, $67. Possibly a lot of work, but it is a credit. 
   
3. Science class + lab at TEL - 4 credits, $267. Not required for TESU but meets science requirement at COSC. 
   
4. Biology at ONU - 3 credits, $150. Not required for TESU but should meet science requirement at COSC. 
   

UMPI is NOT an option because you would need both College Algebra and Statistics from Sophia. Since you stated you would prefer to avoid science as well, I think that also leaves out COSC.

So your choice is really between EC and TESU. Assuming no Pell Grant, EC is cheaper but it may be more difficult for you to meet the UL requirements. TESU costs more but you've got most of the RA credit requirements out of the way so that helps to lower the out-of-pocket costs. If you can get a Pell Grant and take at least 16 credits at TESU, that further lowers the out-of-pocket expenses there.

Since you stated that your goal is an MBA, you might want to consider a business degree at TESU. Using Sophia, you can get most of the way towards a business degree and then fill in the gaps with Study.com and InstantCert. It can cost a little bit more than a liberal studies degree but not that much more. I don't think that you can get a business degree at Excelsior using solely alternate credit but liberal studies is definitely an option.

[dfrecore]

• Charter Oak drawbacks: For instance, you cannot use CSM Learn as a math option to get your degree. This completely eliminates them as an option for some people. It could still be in the running for you because Sophia Algebra is accepted and really isn't that bad as long as you only hate math and don't have something like dyscalculia.
  

Dumb question here - why do you list College Algebra and Stats as the only options for math at COSC?  There are lots of other math courses they will take, including Study.com's MAT 102: College Mathematics or MAT 107: Quantitative Literacy; the College Math CLEP; Contemporary UExcel; Fundamentals of College Algebra or Math for Liberal Arts DSST's; Intermediate Algebra from a CC; Quantitative Analysis I from TEL; MTH 117 - Finite Math from ONU; etc.  LOTS of options other than Sophia.

Because Sophia's Algebra is literally the cheapest, fastest, and arguably easiest way to meet the math requirement. OP does not want exams (which rules out CLEP, UExcel, or DSST). Sophia is open-book for its Milestones & Challenges (quizzes & exams), which Study.com is not, and that makes Sophia a bit easier. ONU, TEL, and CCs are all full math courses and not really what I would consider "low" in math. So, yes, there are a wide variety of options for math but, based on OP's preferences, that severely limits the possibilities.

I guess I was thinking more about the level of math.  A longer course of College Math may be easier than a shorter course of Stats or College Algebra.  Just my opinion, I don't hate math and I thought there were much easier options than College Algebra out there (and I did a bunch).

---

I can tell you what your courses will come in as at all of the Big 3 (or else, I have questions, and I can't find a college called WSC in Massachusetts):

TESU
EN7101: English Composition I - English Comp I requirement
ICS011: Roots of Afro Amer Culture - Diversity requirement
HI111: US History 1 - Knowledge of Human Cultures
PS110: General Psychology I - Knowledge of Human Cultures
COUN100: Orientation to College - Free Electives
PE010: Sports Conditioning - Free Electives
BSOP 100: Open Typewriting Lab - Free Electives
PE040: Intercollegiate Football - Free Electives
PE175: Principles of Coaching - Free Electives
MA7100: Basic Mathematics - unknown, I would have to look at the college catalog to see what they say about this
So you either have 20.5 or 23.5cr. I'd probably just take ONU UL courses to make up the difference

COSC
EN7101: English Composition I - English Comp I requirement
ICS011: Roots of Afro Amer Culture - Social/Behavioral Science requirement
HI111: US History 1 - US History/Government requirement
PS110: General Psychology I - Social/Behavioral Science requirement
COUN100: Orientation to College - Free Electives
PE010: Sports Conditioning - Free Electives
BSOP 100: Open Typewriting Lab - Free Electives
PE040: Intercollegiate Football - Free Electives
PE175: Principles of Coaching - Free Electives
MA7100: Basic Mathematics - unknown, I would have to look at the college catalog to see what they say about this
So you either have 20.5 or 23.5cr. I'd probably just take ONU UL courses to make up the difference

EC
EN7101: English Composition I - Written English I requirement
ICS011: Roots of Afro Amer Culture - Humanities requirement
HI111: US History 1 - Social Science/History requirement
PS110: General Psychology I - Social Science/History requirement
COUN100: Orientation to College - Free Electives
BSOP 100: Open Typewriting Lab - Free Electives
PE010: Sports Conditioning - Free Electives, but over limit
PE040: Intercollegiate Football - Free Electives, will only take 2cr
PE175: Principles of Coaching - Won't transfer in (EC doesn't take D grades)
MA7100: Basic Mathematics - unknown, I would have to look at the college catalog to see what they say about this
So you either have 16 or 19cr. But EC doesn't require any RA credits, so you're fine.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I'm assuming that you want a BALS (TESU)/BSLS (COSC)/BSLA (EC), since you said the fastest and easiest degree. I want to point out that if you don't take Stats, you may find that an MBA is going to be a difficult when you have to take something math-related (most MBA programs have a math-heavy stats-type course). So even though you wouldn't HAVE to take Stats, I would highly suggest it. I'd also suggest that you take all of the courses required in the core (Financial & Managerial Accounting, Finance, Management, Marketing, Business Law, etc.) and you can throw those in Free Electives. At COSC you can even use them in the concentration (do Psych and Business for the most flexibility).