8th grade daughter and U.S. History I CLEP

[exhaustguy]

I am Homeschooling my 8th grade daughter in U.S. History. I would like for her to take the CLEP U.S. History I test probably sometime early summer. Any suggestions or pointers (is it a crazy idea which I should abandon now). She reads at a high level and has a pretty good memory. I currently have her reading Undaunted Courage. If this approach works out, then I would like to pace her with two CLEPS a year for each summer until college. I am planning the following sequence-
U.S. History I and II
American Government
World History I and II
Humanities
English Composition (she loves to write and she is very good - to the point that she helps her 10th grade sister with her Honors English essays).

She is already decided upon a college (our local university). She wants to become a doctor, and all of her energy is placed in that direction. She typically scores in the high 90s in Social Studies and English on her standardized tests.

[rebel100]

Momofmany posted this a few months ago, might help a bit.

CLEP LESSON PLANS

Homeschoolers and clep/dsst are a natural fit to me. I would use the local college as an initial guide regarding what tests to take. They will likely have some tests they accept and some they don't, there will possibly be a limit on how many credits they will accept. Not to say your daughter can't take more than that, just that you should find out where you stand.

[ekamanas]

A lot happens between 8th grade and the end of college, but assuming she actually stuck with the goal and applied to medical school, I'd recommend against taking CLEP exams for anything that is considered a prereq. That includes English composition and any of your basic sciences (Chem, Organic Chem, Physics, Bio, Calculus). It's probably a school-by-school policy, but I know for certain that I've seen schools that explicitly state that CLEP exams cannot be used. I wouldn't worry about taking humanities or social sciences CLEP exams, but I'd wait until college to take the actual prereqs if possible.

*I applied to and was accepted into a few medical schools last year, so I have some wisdom when it comes to the process.

[burbuja0512]

A lot happens between 8th grade and the end of college, but assuming she actually stuck with the goal and applied to medical school, I'd recommend against taking CLEP exams for anything that is considered a prereq. That includes English composition and any of your basic sciences (Chem, Organic Chem, Physics, Bio, Calculus). It's probably a school-by-school policy, but I know for certain that I've seen schools that explicitly state that CLEP exams cannot be used. I wouldn't worry about taking humanities or social sciences CLEP exams, but I'd wait until college to take the actual prereqs if possible.

*I applied to and was accepted into a few medical schools last year, so I have some wisdom when it comes to the process.

What about if she takes CLEPs not with the intent of using them towards med school, but just so that she work towards a degree at age 16 or 17?

The reason I mention this is because my DS wants to be a pharmacist. He already knows that he will have to take a bunch of pre-reqs in a B&M institution. The reason we're doing CLEP/DSST for him is so that he can get his associates degree and have a piece of paper from a real institution that shows he's been learning. (Something more than just a homeschool diploma) As far as I'm concerned, once he has enough credits for the AAS that he wants, he has graduated from high school. His peers in public school are going to graduate in May of 2013 and he'll have gotten the AAS and be taking pharm pre-reqs long before then.

Another case is my DD who is in 7th grade. I don't want her to test quite this young, but in another year or two she will start. She wants to be an orthodontist. (at least right now, but she may change her mind) I already know that a degree full of CLEP credits won't help her with her dental school pre-reqs, but why not start her testing at age 14 or so and she could have a BS or BA before her peers graduate from high school. It certainly couldn't hurt to list that you obtained a bachelors degree at age 16 on a dental school entrance application, right? Couldn't you say the same for med school? I would probably recommend a biz degree for someone in medical to give them some basic know how if they ever open their own practice. OR if they wanted to advance on the health care administration side of things, a BSBA couldn't hurt..

[cookderosa]

A lot happens between 8th grade and the end of college, but assuming she actually stuck with the goal and applied to medical school, I'd recommend against taking CLEP exams for anything that is considered a prereq. That includes English composition and any of your basic sciences (Chem, Organic Chem, Physics, Bio, Calculus). It's probably a school-by-school policy, but I know for certain that I've seen schools that explicitly state that CLEP exams cannot be used. I wouldn't worry about taking humanities or social sciences CLEP exams, but I'd wait until college to take the actual prereqs if possible.

*I applied to and was accepted into a few medical schools last year, so I have some wisdom when it comes to the process.

I completely agree (except for math- on that I disagree, Calculus is only required by a fraction of MD med schools and none of the DO med schools- CLEP that baby and every math below it)

So, CLEP all social sciences and gen eds- avoid sciences and English. As a homeschooler I support your approach.

[ryoder]

My brother has a masters in microbiology and works in cancer research. He had to take general calc I&II and that was it. So go ahead and CLEP those! Or do Straighterline or whatever.
For a medical career, I would take a B&M anatomy and physiology with lab though.
For me, I took A&P at straighterline for my second bachelors in natural science, but since I will never be handling a scalpel, I think that my education will suffice

[ekamanas]

I completely agree (except for math- on that I disagree, Calculus is only required by a fraction of MD med schools and none of the DO med schools- CLEP that baby and every math below it)

So, CLEP all social sciences and gen eds- avoid sciences and English. As a homeschooler I support your approach.

True, Calculus is not a requirement at most schools--but why limit yourself? As you know, when applying to med school, you've gotta cast a very large net.

Plus, considering she's an 8th grader with her sights set on medical school, already looking to take college courses, I'm assuming she's the high-achieving UCSF/Harvard/WUSTL type; and they are just the types that require Calc. :p

* Further disclaimer: I took Calc I-III, advanced linear algebra, probability theory, and graphy theory/combinatorial analysis in college, so I am biased towards encouraging kids to take more math courses!

[ekamanas]

What about if she takes CLEPs not with the intent of using them towards med school, but just so that she work towards a degree at age 16 or 17?

The reason I mention this is because my DS wants to be a pharmacist. He already knows that he will have to take a bunch of pre-reqs in a B&M institution. The reason we're doing CLEP/DSST for him is so that he can get his associates degree and have a piece of paper from a real institution that shows he's been learning. (Something more than just a homeschool diploma) As far as I'm concerned, once he has enough credits for the AAS that he wants, he has graduated from high school. His peers in public school are going to graduate in May of 2013 and he'll have gotten the AAS and be taking pharm pre-reqs long before then.

Another case is my DD who is in 7th grade. I don't want her to test quite this young, but in another year or two she will start. She wants to be an orthodontist. (at least right now, but she may change her mind) I already know that a degree full of CLEP credits won't help her with her dental school pre-reqs, but why not start her testing at age 14 or so and she could have a BS or BA before her peers graduate from high school. It certainly couldn't hurt to list that you obtained a bachelors degree at age 16 on a dental school entrance application, right? Couldn't you say the same for med school? I would probably recommend a biz degree for someone in medical to give them some basic know how if they ever open their own practice. OR if they wanted to advance on the health care administration side of things, a BSBA couldn't hurt..

Showing initiative is great; but at the end of the day, I wouldn't test out of anything that will be used as a pre-req. Just exactly what a pre-req is, well, that's school specific. Pharmacy school, for example, has an exhaustive list (I believe) including everything from economics to chemistry. Dental school pretty much shares the pre-reqs with med school; the usual battery of bio, chem, orgo, physics, English comp 1/2, and Calc 1 (some schools). I've seen some med schools now requiring biochemistry; ditto for dental schools. Hell, I've even seen some requiring genetics and a couple of other advanced bio classes.

As with anything else I say, this isn't gospel. There are certainly schools out there that accept CLEP pre-reqs; but be aware that there are certainly schools that do not. I'm sure no school would care if you CLEP'ed out of accounting, humanities, or French language, for example. But I would not recommend testing out for anything that is a pre-req, in the interest of limiting one's choices the least; med schools are VERY anal about them, in my experience. I doubt dental school is any different.

[cookderosa]

True, Calculus is not a requirement at most schools--but why limit yourself? As you know, when applying to med school, you've gotta cast a very large net.

Plus, considering she's an 8th grader with her sights set on medical school, already looking to take college courses, I'm assuming she's the high-achieving UCSF/Harvard/WUSTL type; and they are just the types that require Calc. :p

* Further disclaimer: I took Calc I-III, advanced linear algebra, probability theory, and graphy theory/combinatorial analysis in college, so I am biased towards encouraging kids to take more math courses!

I am too. She can CLEP calc 1 in high school freeing herself up to take all her higher maths in college. CLEP only goes to Calc 1. This saves her time and money, freeing up her 120 precious slots for higher maths and sciences.
*actually, if we are still having this conversation in 3 years, and the OP is stil here, my advice will change and I'll suggest the AP Calc, but lets take baby steps. What sounds good in your head when you're 13 feels like something else entirely once you've hit puberty

[exhaustguy]

True, Calculus is not a requirement at most schools--but why limit yourself? As you know, when applying to med school, you've gotta cast a very large net.

Plus, considering she's an 8th grader with her sights set on medical school, already looking to take college courses, I'm assuming she's the high-achieving UCSF/Harvard/WUSTL type; and they are just the types that require Calc. :p

* Further disclaimer: I took Calc I-III, advanced linear algebra, probability theory, and graphy theory/combinatorial analysis in college, so I am biased towards encouraging kids to take more math courses!

Thanks for the info. Her med school goals are more modest though - University of Iowa for her first choice with another midwest school her second choice, but if she can't get into Iowa, I don't see how she could get into any other public allopathic school in another state. She might look towards Des Moines University.

She will probably terminate math with Calc I as a college freshman along with junior college Statistics while she is in High School. Math is not her strong point - she has very high verbal ability and a real understanding and love of science. I tutor her extensively in Algebra trying to get her speed up, but she is probably a B/B+ student in that class (not able to work fast enough on rigorous timed tests). The situation only gets worse as she proceeds along. Her sister is in Algebra II/Trig this year and barely has an A. Most of her 4.0 peers are not even close to an A now.

Right now my 8th grader is looking at a double B.A. in Biology/Biochemistry which maps well to medical school. She would also like to pursue a Minor in Writing (either Creative or Technical - still TBD). I know many medical students especially B.S. Science and Engineering take math up to Differential Equations, but that is not for her. I am an engineer so I know what will be involved with the higher math classes. You can be a 3.0 and still get a great job as an engineer. You can't get into medical school with anything less than a 3.5. She would make a great doctor and probably a fair engineer, but she would never get into medical school if she had to take 4 semesters of Calc/Differential Equations.