Grading and politics

[davewill]

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Nice find!  $145/cr is a GREAT price.  Just an FYI, they don't allow international students; and I'm not certain you can take these courses if you live in certain states (western?).  Not sure why.
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The FAQ seems to say your state doesn't matter:

Do you offer your courses and/or programs in my state?
Yes! Some reciprocity maps specify that California residents are not eligible. However, because we are a private institution, California residents are eligible to enroll at SC.

I wouldn't particularly appreciate a "Christ-centered" approach, but it were the cheapest or only way to get a course...

I still remember those Biola ethics lectures my Saylor Env Ethics course used with the snide, "of course we know better" commentary peppered throughout. At least the Prof did a good job with the material otherwise.

[dfrecore]

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Nice find!  $145/cr is a GREAT price.  Just an FYI, they don't allow international students; and I'm not certain you can take these courses if you live in certain states (western?).  Not sure why.
...

The FAQ seems to say your state doesn't matter:

Do you offer your courses and/or programs in my state?
Yes! Some reciprocity maps specify that California residents are not eligible. However, because we are a private institution, California residents are eligible to enroll at SC.

I wouldn't particularly appreciate a "Christ-centered" approach, but it were the cheapest or only way to get a course...

I still remember those Biola ethics lectures my Saylor Env Ethics course used with the snide, "of course we know better" commentary peppered throughout. At least the Prof did a good job with the material otherwise.

I know plenty of non-Christian professors are exactly the same. Try turning in a paper to an extremely liberal professor you don't agree with - and getting a bad grade because of it.  A teacher should be open-minded enough to allow students to disagree with them without giving them a bad grade just for their views.  I know students who now just say "I'm going to give that stupid professor what they want" just so they don't fail a class.  That is no way to run a class/school/country.  College is supposed to be a time of growing and learning, not suppressing your thoughts so as not to offend.  It's a damn shame.

[rachel83az]

Without going into too much detail, my religious beliefs likely don't align with either Sterling or Olivet either. But I don't care where the credits are from so long as I am not violently opposed to the institution. I don't think I would want any Liberty credits, for instance, even if they were completely free.

[StoicJ]

Without going into too much detail, my religious beliefs likely don't align with either Sterling or Olivet either. But I don't care where the credits are from so long as I am not violently opposed to the institution. I don't think I would want any Liberty credits, for instance, even if they were completely free.

My "no go" list is growing, with Evergreen at the top.

[Merlin]

That is no way to run a class/school/country.  College is supposed to be a time of growing and learning, not suppressing your thoughts so as not to offend.  It's a damn shame.

Obviously, that isn't a universal truth either. We can't make sweeping judgments against the entirety of academia based on the behavior of a small sample. Not that I think you are suggesting that.

I am sure there are plenty of unbiased college instructors out there as well. For example, my wife is a college professor. According to her, she comes across many cringeworthy papers (and political views are the least of reasons for this). If they meet the requirements of the assignment she doesn't let her personal biases influence how she scores papers, she follows the rubric based on the assignment. As she says, everyone is entitled to their own opinions, particularly in college. I'm sure she isn't the only one out there with this opinion.

However, I don't really think that it is that big of a deal in the long term. Yeah, it does suck when people come across unprofessional, biased professors (regardless of political or personal views), but my bet is that the opinion of one college professor isn't going to change anyone's mind about their beliefs anyway. Even the opinions of a few professors. I think college students are more resilient than that and are able to make their own decisions.

[dfrecore]

That is no way to run a class/school/country.  College is supposed to be a time of growing and learning, not suppressing your thoughts so as not to offend.  It's a damn shame.

Obviously, that isn't a universal truth either. We can't make sweeping judgments against the entirety of academia based on the behavior of a small sample. Not that I think you are suggesting that.

I am sure there are plenty of unbiased college instructors out there as well. For example, my wife is a college professor. According to her, she comes across many cringeworthy papers (and political views are the least of reasons for this). If they meet the requirements of the assignment she doesn't let her personal biases influence how she scores papers, she follows the rubric based on the assignment. As she says, everyone is entitled to their own opinions, particularly in college. I'm sure she isn't the only one out there with this opinion.

However, I don't really think that it is that big of a deal in the long term. Yeah, it does suck when people come across unprofessional, biased professors (regardless of political or personal views), but my bet is that the opinion of one college professor isn't going to change anyone's mind about their beliefs anyway. Even the opinions of a few professors. I think college students are more resilient than that and are able to make their own decisions.

Hmmmm...due to cancel culture and shutting down free speech on college campuses across the country, safe spaces at many schools, etc., I think you are completely wrong.  They've done surveys, and college students who are more to the right do not feel like they can express their views.

I appreciate your wife's views, but I don't think she's the norm.  I think there are a LOT of professors who are so biased that you can't even have discussions about things they don't agree with.

[Merlin]

Hmmmm...due to cancel culture and shutting down free speech on college campuses across the country, safe spaces at many schools, etc., I think you are completely wrong.  They've done surveys, and college students who are more to the right do not feel like they can express their views.

Well, I think it probably has more to do with how and where people express their views. There are appropriate venues and times for different kinds of discussions. I know that this can sometimes be a problem at college since kids don't always understand that or understand boundaries.

Of course, students should also consider whether the college they are attending is the right fit for them. Every school has its own culture and tends to attract particular types of students. If a student doesn't feel comfortable at school or feels like they cannot express their views because those views are too different than other students and faculty, then maybe they are at the wrong school. That said, I also believe that schools should be a safe space for everyone and they should also go out of their way to accommodate (or at least tolerate) different opinions. But my desires don't really factor into how things really work.

As an aside, I have discovered that am becoming annoyed when people use the phrase cancel culture. It isn't like shutting down things we don't like or that are unpopular is new or a change in culture. That been around forever and extends well beyond politics. These days it feels like people are using that buzzword whenever other people ignore their point of view or stop them from doing something they want. So it is starting to feel like whining.

I appreciate your wife's views, but I don't think she's the norm.  I think there are a LOT of professors who are so biased that you can't even have discussions about things they don't agree with.

I think there is a difference between a teacher refusing to have a discussion and how they grade a paper that is based on a written rubric. Bias in the former I can understand, but bias in the latter seems unacceptable.

There are plenty of people that I know I wouldn't enjoy a conversation with, so I don't put myself in a position to have one. Professors don't always have that luxury. They are constantly being put in positions where have to engage with students and being inundated with questions and opinions. I can only imagine how draining that has to be. Particularly when people want to bring up politics when you're not in a class focusing on politics. Of course, I also feel like people are over-politicizing everything these days and turning everything into a partisan issue. If I were a professor, I think I'd probably shut down those kinds of conversations as well, or at least table them for a more appropriate time and venue.

Of course, I'm sure that biases also run both ways. I expect that there are also students that are so biased that they are unwilling to consider other opinions or ways of looking at the world, even from professors. This goes back to probably being at the wrong school to begin with.

[dfrecore]

Hmmmm...due to cancel culture and shutting down free speech on college campuses across the country, safe spaces at many schools, etc., I think you are completely wrong.  They've done surveys, and college students who are more to the right do not feel like they can express their views.

Well, I think it probably has more to do with how and where people express their views. There are appropriate venues and times for different kinds of discussions. I know that this can sometimes be a problem at college since kids don't always understand that or understand boundaries.

Of course, students should also consider whether the college they are attending is the right fit for them. Every school has its own culture and tends to attract particular types of students. If a student doesn't feel comfortable at school or feels like they cannot express their views because those views are too different than other students and faculty, then maybe they are at the wrong school. That said, I also believe that schools should be a safe space for everyone and they should also go out of their way to accommodate (or at least tolerate) different opinions. But my desires don't really factor into how things really work.

As an aside, I have discovered that am becoming annoyed when people use the phrase cancel culture. It isn't like shutting down things we don't like or that are unpopular is new or a change in culture. That been around forever and extends well beyond politics. These days it feels like people are using that buzzword whenever other people ignore their point of view or stop them from doing something they want. So it is starting to feel like whining.

I appreciate your wife's views, but I don't think she's the norm.  I think there are a LOT of professors who are so biased that you can't even have discussions about things they don't agree with.

I think there is a difference between a teacher refusing to have a discussion and how they grade a paper that is based on a written rubric. Bias in the former I can understand, but bias in the latter seems unacceptable.

There are plenty of people that I know I wouldn't enjoy a conversation with, so I don't put myself in a position to have one. Professors don't always have that luxury. They are constantly being put in positions where have to engage with students and being inundated with questions and opinions. I can only imagine how draining that has to be. Particularly when people want to bring up politics when you're not in a class focusing on politics. Of course, I also feel like people are over-politicizing everything these days and turning everything into a partisan issue. If I were a professor, I think I'd probably shut down those kinds of conversations as well, or at least table them for a more appropriate time and venue.

Of course, I'm sure that biases also run both ways. I expect that there are also students that are so biased that they are unwilling to consider other opinions or ways of looking at the world, even from professors. This goes back to probably being at the wrong school to begin with.

For one particular student I know, he was at our local CC, so it's not like he has thousands of other choices.  He is literally one of the NICEST, sweetest kids I've met, and it was an American Government class.  And he was pro-constitution...and got an F on a paper for saying why the constitution was a great document.  He was a straight-A student in high school, and a straight-A student in 3 semesters in college, so it's not like he wrote a bad paper, and he knew it.  He just dropped the class and moved on to a non-crazy teacher.

Even my daughter, who would not ever publicly challenge a teacher in any respect (she's just not a confrontational kid) said "oh great, another crazy teacher" and her boyfriend said "just spout a bunch of nonsense and get a good grade." And several friends chimed in with "yep, just tell them what they want to hear, make crap up, say you've been raped, or are trans or something, and you'll be fine." These are 18/19yo's from different schools, none are particularly political or adamantly right-wing, and yet they've all learned how to play the game by their first semester in college!  Yep, these are all kids who graduated in 2020, and have a single semester under their belt and just make crap up to get a good grade.  Every single one of them (and there were like 6 of them talking).

[rachel83az]

Even Sophia courses have "instructor bias" in courses that have no instructor interaction! One of the reasons why Ethics and US History II at Sophia are so difficult for students is because of the instructor bias in the questions. Bias that isn't really supported in the reading material that Sophia has provided. I wouldn't even say that it's liberal bias or conservative bias, it's (to my mind) someone who is trying to be completely neutral and failing miserably at it. It feels like someone who is conservative and trying to make liberal-leaning questions but it could just as easily be someone who is liberal and trying to make more conservative-sounding questions. I don't remember specifically why I felt that way but it did make going through some of the courses a bit more challenging than they would otherwise be. On various questions, you have to guess what the instructor wants you to put in, not what makes sense based on everything you've read.

[StoicJ]

As an aside, I have discovered that am becoming annoyed when people use the phrase cancel culture. It isn't like shutting down things we don't like or that are unpopular is new or a change in culture. That been around forever and extends well beyond politics. These days it feels like people are using that buzzword whenever other people ignore their point of view or stop them from doing something they want. So it is starting to feel like whining.

It's amazing to me how the Left in this country has changed over the last few years.