Request for Review on TESU BSBA Plan

[dfrecore]

You need to switch Intro to Programming (COS-111) with Computer Architecture (COS-330) so that you get another UL course into the AOS - you need 12cr total of UL there. Easy enough to do though.

You also need to find out what's going to happen in the Professional Business Requirements, because I don't think they will give you a waiver on being short credits there. Those 2.75cr courses are a killer.

Here's what I would do:
1) move CIS-107 to Gen Ed Electives
2) take a different computer course that's 3cr
3) move COM-300 to the Knowledge of Human Cultures area
4) take MAN-373

You know for sure that you need English Comp I & II, Speech, College Algebra, Stats, 3 courses from Civic & Global Learning area. 1 SocSci/Hum course. 1 Gen Ed Elective. Plus all of the Professional Business Requirements.

Then, decide if you want to take the 4 additional courses in GM AOS or not.

[scoriae]

I received my evaluation completed email about 12 hours ago! And promptly scheduled a meeting with an advisor. I also emailed advising about adding the CIS AOS to my education plan, which they did within 3 hours of the email too!

This has caused me to re-update my excel sheet once again, which I have attached in this post. The two BSBA AOS was completed separately from one another, which left differences in courses in some areas (understandably so).

The excel file has three tabs, GM, CIS and Unified Estimate. The GM and CIS are the evaluations as is, including any notes for exceptions granted, and the Unified Estimate is what I was curious about.

The CIS had one class missing from the AOS which I believe should be easily filled by most of my other UL level computer courses as they shouldn't overlap and fulfil the requirement. The GM one has remained unchanged.

The Unified Estimate tab is what I hope to draw some attention to. I've included the information you've stated, which I have marked down as yellow in order to complete the AOS requirement for the CIS. To that end, I also had some follow-up questions that I might hope yourself, bjcheung77 and other TESU Applicants/Veterans/Students may be able to help me in clarifying!

- Is it better to email in ahead of time or wait until I speak to the advisor next Tuesday?
- Would it make sense to have the two BSBA paths have a common/unified set of classes for all areas except the AOS?
- Is it reasonable to request the exceptions made to be applicable to both paths such that "the best option is selected out of the two?" An example is the exception of the 0.5 credit in the CIS evaluation which was not presented in the GM evaluation.
- I also believe that my other computer classes should satisfy the Gen. Ed. Electives but were not utilized. Is there a way I may be able to appeal this?
- Is it Kosher to throw all of this at once during the call? I am not a TESU Official so I cant really say "do this, do that", and my understanding of the system is still rudimentary at best, but logically I want to believe that the unified estimate makes enough sense that TESU would be receptive to it.

In addition, I am thinking of taking the OPIc for a foreign language if it would be a cost-effective way of obtaining fast, cheap credits. I have high-intermediate fluency in the Korean language as evaluated by the TOPIK Exam (Korean's equivalent to TOEIC), though I understand this is not recognized by the ACE system nor TESU directly. I understand that the Korean course may fit under the Soc/Human Culture section, if I did my research correctly on this forum, and am lowballing for only 3 credits. In the event I do score another 3 credits on the same exam for a total of 6, how would I be able to utilize the excess? I understand it is split into 3 credit blocks each, instead of a 6 credit block.

So many questions, so excited! And as always, I sincerely appreciate the feedback and assistance

Color Scheme
- Light Tan: Lower Level
- Dark Tan: Upper Level
- Yellow: Proposed Change

[bjcheung77]

- Is it better to email in ahead of time or wait until I speak to the advisor next Tuesday? Doesn't matter
- Would it make sense to have the two BSBA paths have a common/unified set of classes for all areas except the AOS? All BSBA courses should be identical except the AOS's
- Is it reasonable to request the exceptions made to be applicable to both paths such that "the best option is selected out of the two?" An example is the exception of the 0.5 credit in the CIS evaluation which was not presented in the GM evaluation. I would try to get as many exceptions as possible if they allow it!
- I also believe that my other computer classes should satisfy the Gen. Ed. Electives but were not utilized. Is there a way I may be able to appeal this? You can try to see if there are similar courses on their course catalog and the CAP/CIS/ITS course you have (review the course description/syllabus)
- Is it Kosher to throw all of this at once during the call? I am not a TESU Official so I cant really say "do this, do that", and my understanding of the system is still rudimentary at best, but logically I want to believe that the unified estimate makes enough sense that TESU would be receptive to it. I would do that and also email them to verify it in writing as well.

I say the unified estimate is the way to go, you just need 4 extra courses compared to going either route.
Those 4 courses won't take you too long at all! Keep trucking, you can finish this, we're rooting for you.

[dfrecore]

The excel file has three tabs, GM, CIS and Unified Estimate. The GM and CIS are the evaluations as is, including any notes for exceptions granted, and the Unified Estimate is what I was curious about.

The CIS had one class missing from the AOS which I believe should be easily filled by most of my other UL level computer courses as they shouldn't overlap and fulfil the requirement. TESU will not take ANY courses that overlap, so if it's in the eval, it is it's own distinct course.

Database Management and Computer Architecture should definitely come into the AOS, as they're specifically listed as CIS electives on the website. Ask them to move one of them to the AOS.




- Is it better to email in ahead of time or wait until I speak to the advisor next Tuesday? Either one is fine.
- Would it make sense to have the two BSBA paths have a common/unified set of classes for all areas except the AOS? Yes, that's how they'll set it up.
- Is it reasonable to request the exceptions made to be applicable to both paths such that "the best option is selected out of the two?" An example is the exception of the 0.5 credit in the CIS evaluation which was not presented in the GM evaluation. You will just have to tell them how to move things around, their system isn't advanced enough to "select" the best option all the time. But, once you have things put in there the way you want them, they'll be set in stone. The only thing you have to do is watch each time you send credits and make sure they don't accidentally move stuff. This happened to me twice.
- I also believe that my other computer classes should satisfy the Gen. Ed. Electives but were not utilized. Is there a way I may be able to appeal this? Most courses that are CIS or COS should go in Gen Ed, anything that is CAP will not. You could check to see if CIS-299 would work in GE, but it might not. Nothing else in the "Unused" area will go up to Gen Ed.
- Is it Kosher to throw all of this at once during the call? I am not a TESU Official so I cant really say "do this, do that", and my understanding of the system is still rudimentary at best, but logically I want to believe that the unified estimate makes enough sense that TESU would be receptive to it. Don't make it too complicated. Just ask them to move 1 thing at a time, they will do it right on the phone if it works. Then, do the next thing. Don't have them "switch" two courses. Just say "can you move COS-350 to the AOS?" If the answer is yes, great. If it's no, then ask"can you move CIS-311 to the AOS?" I'm not kidding, you have to be very explicit in your questions, and make it as uncomplicated and clear as is humanly possible. Once they move something, thank them, then ask for the next thing.

In addition, I am thinking of taking the OPIc for a foreign language if it would be a cost-effective way of obtaining fast, cheap credits. I have high-intermediate fluency in the Korean language as evaluated by the TOPIK Exam (Korean's equivalent to TOEIC), though I understand this is not recognized by the ACE system nor TESU directly. I understand that the Korean course may fit under the Soc/Human Culture section, if I did my research correctly on this forum, and am lowballing for only 3 credits. In the event I do score another 3 credits on the same exam for a total of 6, how would I be able to utilize the excess? I understand it is split into 3 credit blocks each, instead of a 6 credit block. Yes, ACTFL is a great way to get credits! Do Korean if it's available, and you'll get 6, 9, even 12cr. That should take care of Area C and Gen Ed Electives.

So many questions, so excited! And as always, I sincerely appreciate the feedback and assistance

Color Scheme
- Light Tan: Lower Level
- Dark Tan: Upper Level
- Yellow: Proposed Change

My answers are above.

[scoriae]

dfrecore and bjcheung77,

If only I could spruce up my dusty culinary schools and make a decent meal for each of you...

Thank you for your responses. I believe I will be able to step into the advising consultation fully prepared to at least advance my agenda in a significant way.

Im probably going to be bumping this post up as questions do form, but again, the advice provided is very much appreciated and I hope I can continue to seek it as I move forward with this

[scoriae]

So an update on this plan (and I think this thread may turn into a log of sorts moving forward...)

I contacted Academic Advising yesterday to talk about potentially moving courses over. It was a difficult process to explain as to why I wanted to move certain courses around, but it ultimately came to a standstill once I was told that the courses I had hoped to be moved, could not be moved due to various reasons (over the age limit of 7 years, not an applicable course despite it being computer related, and limitations of programming). This was partially due to one course being incorrectly recorded on my end as a upper level course, when it was actually a lower-level course as evaluated by TESU, an oversight on my end since I was looking at the left column and not the right. It was the only course that was marked differently from the 'left column', upon re-checking.

Since the previous update, I have completed the following:
- ALEKS Intermediate Algebra to be used in General Education Electives as MAT-115
- ALEKS PreCalculus to be used in General Education Electives as MAT-129
- ALEKS College Algebra to be used in Intellectucal and Practical Skills as MAT-121
- The Institute's Ethics and the CPCU Code of Professional Conduct to be used in Civic & Global Learning as PHI-384
- SOPHIA's Building Effective Teams to be used in the General Management Area of Studies as HRM-299 to offset the weird credit count from transferring in from my old college

I have not confirmed any of the above with TESU as it seems to be generally accepted as stated, but for peace of mind if someone may be able to confirm these...

In addition, due to the gap in the CIS AOS, I was wondering if anyone had experience in applying 'Management Information Systems' for both the GM and CIS AOS? According to the TESU Undergrad Program Policies, up to 9 courses can be applied in two AOSes, but I also understand GM to be a bit on the fuzzy side. If they would accept it, it would fulfil the entirety of the CIS AOS requirements and knock off 3 credits of an upper level course in the GM AOS requirements!

[dfrecore]

Since the previous update, I have completed the following:
- ALEKS Intermediate Algebra to be used in General Education Electives as MAT-115
- ALEKS PreCalculus to be used in General Education Electives as MAT-129
- ALEKS College Algebra to be used in Intellectucal and Practical Skills as MAT-121
- The Institute's Ethics and the CPCU Code of Professional Conduct to be used in Civic & Global Learning as PHI-384
- SOPHIA's Building Effective Teams to be used in the General Management Area of Studies as HRM-299 to offset the weird credit count from transferring in from my old college

I have not confirmed any of the above with TESU as it seems to be generally accepted as stated, but for peace of mind if someone may be able to confirm these...

In addition, due to the gap in the CIS AOS, I was wondering if anyone had experience in applying 'Management Information Systems' for both the GM and CIS AOS? According to the TESU Undergrad Program Policies, up to 9 courses can be applied in two AOSes, but I also understand GM to be a bit on the fuzzy side. If they would accept it, it would fulfil the entirety of the CIS AOS requirements and knock off 3 credits of an upper level course in the GM AOS requirements!

Yes, those courses should work exactly where you want them.

As for the dual BSBA in GM/CIS, my understanding is that you have to do each concentration separately, with no overlap. When they say 9cr of overlap in 2 different degrees, they are referring to something like Psychology and Sociology (just an example). Each of those has 39/33cr in the Area of Study (the major). When looking at the BSBA, you're already overlapping courses in the core (the major), you can't then also overlap courses in the AOS (concentration). You need 18cr in the GM area, and 18cr in the CIS area.

Most of the problem here comes from TESU's wording - they are so inconsistent in how they word things, it's ridiculous. They should make the BSBA consistent with the other degrees, and call the entire major the AOS, and the lower section the Concentration, so that it's not confusing.

You can double-check that if you want, as the GM/anything else being able to have a dual degree is completely new. You used to not be able to get that, you could do 2 AOS's like CIS and Accounting, which would have zero courses that would overlap anyway. But it's my understanding that you cannot overlap the BSBA Concentrations at all.

[scoriae]

Thank you for your response dfrecore. That is indeed frustrating and I believe I did read the exact same regarding wording ambiguity somewhere when I was in lurk mode... In this case, I would probably throw the Management Information Systems in CIS to finish off the AOS, and pick up an additional course for the GM AOS. Sad days...

I will double-check with TESU just in case, however. While I should have and am expecting set-backs, it does take away from the gung-ho-'o-meter when this happens

[scoriae]

To follow up, TESU has responded confirm the inability to overlap the two. This is quite frustrating given the website stating via Two Areas of Study Within One Degree

Students may complete up to two areas of study within one bachelor's degree. No more than 9 credits that are used in the first area of study may be used for the second area of study. All related required credits for each area of study, as well as all degree requirements, must be met at the same time. Students cannot complete a third area of study within one bachelor's degree.

I've re-read this multiple times to see if there was a different interpretation I may have simply missed, but I am unable to get it. As always, I appreciate the information you've provided, but....



Looks like I will be throwing in one additional course.

[dfrecore]

To follow up, TESU has responded confirm the inability to overlap the two. This is quite frustrating given the website stating via Two Areas of Study Within One Degree

I agree, it's certainly not ambiguous here. But, what will be argued, when you contact them, is the meaning of Area of Study as it relates to the Business degree. I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just saying that they probably won't go for it. But I'd certainly contact them, and send them this link, as well as the links to both of the business degrees that you want, and see what happens, if you want to fight it.

I would say that at best, they'll say it doesn't apply to the BSBA. At worst though, they may decide that you can't get a GM and another AOS for the BSBA. I definitely wouldn't be surprised if they did this.