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+--- Thread: Forensic-science-relevant second bachelor's for people who already have a BA (/Thread-Forensic-science-relevant-second-bachelor-s-for-people-who-already-have-a-BA)
Forensic-science-relevant second bachelor's for people who already have a BA - 1652Q - 06-26-2021
Hello. I was hoping I could get some advice on a very niche topic. I'm a lawyer who already has a BA in a non-scientific field, and a law degree. As part of my job, I work a *lot* with forensic science experts. The overwhelming majority of these experts are in broadly medical fields: toxicology, psychology/psychiatry, blood spatter, pathology, DNA identification, etc. I'm always eager to learn more about these areas, both as personal enrichment and to improve my own job performance.
I wondered whether there are any inexpensive pathways to education in forensic sciences by distance learning. Do any of the Big Three (or anyone comparable) offer degrees that would (1) be relevant, (2) which do not require residency, and (3) which allow people to get credit for tests or programs like Straighterline, CLEP, DSST, etc.?
If I could get a second bachelor's degree in a relevant area inexpensively via distance learning (and mostly through CLEP/DSST/Straighterline/Study.com/etc. style testing out) it might actually be worth it for me to do it. I find myself having to study a lot of this material anyway (both as part of my job and enrichment), and it would be better if I could do so systematically. Earning a degree at the end of the process would also be nice, even if it takes a while.,
Anyway, any guidance you have about programs, tests, online courses, etc. would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks!
RE: Forensic-science-relevant second bachelor's for people who already have a BA - rachel83az - 06-26-2021
None of the big 3 offer a degree in forensic sciences. The closest any of them have would be degrees in criminal justice and that is obviously an entirely different field.
UMGC has a degree in investigative forensics: https://www.umgc.edu/academic-programs/bachelors-degrees/investigative-forensics-major.cfm Because you already have a degree, you would need 30 new credits: https://www.umgc.edu/academic-programs/bachelors-degrees/second-bachelors-degree.cfm
Liberty University offers a degree in crime scene investigation: https://www.liberty.edu/online/government/bachelors/criminal-justice/crime-scene-investigation/ Similar credit requirements apply: https://catalog.liberty.edu/undergraduate/academic-support/academic-information-policies-online-program/
Columbia College (not to be confused with Columbia University) offers a Criminal Justice degree with a concentration in Forensics: https://www.columbiasc.edu/program/criminal-justice I can't find any specifics for students who already have a degree but I would assume it would be the same as the first two.
No matter where you went, because you already have one degree, universities tend to waive the gen ed credit requirements. So there would be nothing to CLEP and there would be no relevant DSST exams. There are a handful of TEEX courses that might fit ( https://degreeforum.miraheze.org/wiki/TEEX ) but forensic science isn't something that you can easily get alternative credits for.
RE: Forensic-science-relevant second bachelor's for people who already have a BA - 1652Q - 06-26-2021
(06-26-2021, 03:45 PM)rachel83az Wrote: None of the big 3 offer a degree in forensic sciences. The closest any of them have would be degrees in criminal justice and that is obviously an entirely different field.Thank you! Much appreciated. Out of curiosity, are there any sorts of general-science-oriented degrees that might offer alternative credit options for courses broadly relevant to forensics -- like biology, psychology, human anatomy, and so on?
UMGC has a degree in investigative forensics: https://www.umgc.edu/academic-programs/bachelors-degrees/investigative-forensics-major.cfm Because you already have a degree, you would need 30 new credits: https://www.umgc.edu/academic-programs/bachelors-degrees/second-bachelors-degree.cfm
Liberty University offers a degree in crime scene investigation: https://www.liberty.edu/online/government/bachelors/criminal-justice/crime-scene-investigation/ Similar credit requirements apply: https://catalog.liberty.edu/undergraduate/academic-support/academic-information-policies-online-program/
Columbia College (not to be confused with Columbia University) offers a Criminal Justice degree with a concentration in Forensics: https://www.columbiasc.edu/program/criminal-justice I can't find any specifics for students who already have a degree but I would assume it would be the same as the first two.
No matter where you went, because you already have one degree, universities tend to waive the gen ed credit requirements. So there would be nothing to CLEP and there would be no relevant DSST exams. There are a handful of TEEX courses that might fit ( https://degreeforum.miraheze.org/wiki/TEEX ) but forensic science isn't something that you can easily get alternative credits for.
I ask because I remember bumping into one anecdote on this forum about a Natural Sciences and Mathematics concentration at TESU, for example. But I don't know whether someone could customize existing science degrees enough that they would be useful for what I'm aiming at. Even if it's not a degree specialized in forensic applications, if I can get something that teaches me the sciences more broadly that get applied to forensic purposes, that might still be helpful.
RE: Forensic-science-relevant second bachelor's for people who already have a BA - rachel83az - 06-26-2021
TESU does have a Liberal Studies degree with a concentration in Natural Sciences & Math. https://degreeforum.miraheze.org/wiki/Sample_TESU_BA_Liberal_Studies_Degree_Plan#Liberal_Studies_-_Natural_Sciences_&_Mathematics_Concentration While that does include forensic science, I'm not sure if any of the TEEX courses would actually count. They should. But TESU might count them as pure Criminal Justice courses and Criminal Justice is a Social Science. If that's the case, they'd still count for the "liberal studies" but not for the specific concentration.
TESU requires 24 additional credits (21 + capstone) for a second degree: https://iq3prod1.smartcatalogiq.com/Catalogs/Thomas-Edison-State-University/current/Undergraduate-Catalog/University-Policies-and-Procedures/Undergraduate-Academic-Policies/Degree-Policies/Award-of-Degrees
What you could do would be to take any TEEX courses you are interested in (they're pretty quick and, in some ways, not unlike pure exams), transfer them to TESU, and see where they get put before making further plans for courses to take.
RE: Forensic-science-relevant second bachelor's for people who already have a BA - 1652Q - 06-26-2021
(06-26-2021, 05:10 PM)rachel83az Wrote: TESU does have a Liberal Studies degree with a concentration in Natural Sciences & Math. https://degreeforum.miraheze.org/wiki/Sample_TESU_BA_Liberal_Studies_Degree_Plan#Liberal_Studies_-_Natural_Sciences_&_Mathematics_Concentration While that does include forensic science, I'm not sure if any of the TEEX courses would actually count. They should. But TESU might count them as pure Criminal Justice courses and Criminal Justice is a Social Science. If that's the case, they'd still count for the "liberal studies" but not for the specific concentration.
TESU requires 24 additional credits (21 + capstone) for a second degree: https://iq3prod1.smartcatalogiq.com/Catalogs/Thomas-Edison-State-University/current/Undergraduate-Catalog/University-Policies-and-Procedures/Undergraduate-Academic-Policies/Degree-Policies/Award-of-Degrees
What you could do would be to take any TEEX courses you are interested in (they're pretty quick and, in some ways, not unlike pure exams), transfer them to TESU, and see where they get put before making further plans for courses to take.
Hm...that sounds promising; thanks. Do you think that such a degree would require labs that I would need to complete in person or at a local community college? Or would it be a pure distance learning experience? The latter might be easier on my schedule.
I remember also seeing a thread about somebody who combined a psych BA and Natural Sciences + Math concentration at TESU (with only a single capstone), so perhaps there's room for mix and match customization. Hopefully, anyway!
RE: Forensic-science-relevant second bachelor's for people who already have a BA - rachel83az - 06-26-2021
You could definitely do psych + Liberal Studies. TESU counts that as a single degree. You'd obviously have to do more credits that way, but it's totally possible.
As for lab science: if you wanted to do LL lab sciences, there are some biology courses that you could take at Study.com or you could do self-paced classes through Portage: https://portagelearning.com/courses/biology The biggest issue would be the UL courses. There are not a lot of UL science credits.
Potentially, you could do:
Physiological Psychology (PSY-303) through Coopersmith
Pathophysiology as a UExcel exam
Death Investigation from TEEX (assuming this counts)
But that still leaves 6 UL credits. Doane has some biology courses that should come in as UL: https://www.doane.edu/lp/prereqs.html
WWU has UL Medical Anthropology that may or may not count. https://online.wwu.edu/courses They also have an UL geology course about dinosaurs. It's outside of what you want to study, but it would be an UL science course.
Oregon State has a number of biology classes: https://ecampus.oregonstate.edu/soc/ecatalog/subjectcourses.htm?termcode=all#0B
RE: Forensic-science-relevant second bachelor's for people who already have a BA - 1652Q - 06-26-2021
(06-26-2021, 05:59 PM)rachel83az Wrote: You could definitely do psych + Liberal Studies. TESU counts that as a single degree. You'd obviously have to do more credits that way, but it's totally possible.Interesting; thanks! If it would help for the natural science / math portion, I would certainly be willing to expand into computer science or math territory for UL courses. Some of the stuff I deal with in my job blends over into computer related subjects, like DNA analysis programs or computer forensics (ED: or math/physics for crash and other reconstruction, etc.) But I don't know whether any of that would be accepted as "natural science" credit or not.
As for lab science: if you wanted to do LL lab sciences, there are some biology courses that you could take at Study.com or you could do self-paced classes through Portage: https://portagelearning.com/courses/biology The biggest issue would be the UL courses. There are not a lot of UL science credits.
Potentially, you could do:
Physiological Psychology (PSY-303) through Coopersmith
Pathophysiology as a UExcel exam
Death Investigation from TEEX (assuming this counts)
But that still leaves 6 UL credits. Doane has some biology courses that should come in as UL: https://www.doane.edu/lp/prereqs.html
WWU has UL Medical Anthropology that may or may not count. https://online.wwu.edu/courses They also have an UL geology course about dinosaurs. It's outside of what you want to study, but it would be an UL science course.
Oregon State has a number of biology classes: https://ecampus.oregonstate.edu/soc/ecatalog/subjectcourses.htm?termcode=all#0B
RE: Forensic-science-relevant second bachelor's for people who already have a BA - rachel83az - 06-26-2021
Computer science and computer information systems courses definitely do count for the concentration.
Database management @ Study.com is relatively simple for an UL course. It has one assignment: creating a database. The instructions aren't the clearest but it's pretty easy. If you've done basic office/clerical work, this should be easy to pass.
Systems Analysis & Design only has 1 assignment to complete. Come up with a new computer system (hardware/software implementation) for a fictional company.
Computer Architecture also only has one assignment but it's apparently insane. Design & implement a CPU. Avoid unless you really like this aspect of computers for some bizarre reason.
Management Information Systems has 3 assignments; these are mostly business case studies for real companies.
Study.com courses also have quizzes & a final exam, so it's not just these assignments that you'd need to complete.
RE: Forensic-science-relevant second bachelor's for people who already have a BA - 1652Q - 06-26-2021
(06-26-2021, 06:52 PM)rachel83az Wrote: Computer science and computer information systems courses definitely do count for the concentration.Great! Thanks again; this is starting to look like a promising avenue to explore. It's neat how eclectic this degree option is.
Database management @ Study.com is relatively simple for an UL course. It has one assignment: creating a database. The instructions aren't the clearest but it's pretty easy. If you've done basic office/clerical work, this should be easy to pass.
Systems Analysis & Design only has 1 assignment to complete. Come up with a new computer system (hardware/software implementation) for a fictional company.
Computer Architecture also only has one assignment but it's apparently insane. Design & implement a CPU. Avoid unless you really like this aspect of computers for some bizarre reason.
Management Information Systems has 3 assignments; these are mostly business case studies for real companies.
Study.com courses also have quizzes & a final exam, so it's not just these assignments that you'd need to complete.
RE: Forensic-science-relevant second bachelor's for people who already have a BA - sanantone - 06-26-2021
Might as well get a master's degree. University of Florida has many graduate certificate and master's programs in forensic science and forensic medicine.