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+--- Thread: In your opinion, who should not earn a degree from the Big Three? (/Thread-In-your-opinion-who-should-not-earn-a-degree-from-the-Big-Three)
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In your opinion, who should not earn a degree from the Big Three? - theclepexam - 04-13-2019
What are the main cases of students who probably shouldn't earn their degree from Excelsior, Thomas Edison, or Charter Oak?
RE: In your opinion, who should not earn a degree from the Big Three? - jsd - 04-13-2019
Most traditional college age kids will be missing out on a lot of the helpful socializing aspects of college and intro to the adult world.
But not many traditional college age kids can afford the experience, so that point is moot for a lot of people.
RE: In your opinion, who should not earn a degree from the Big Three? - zzzz24 - 04-13-2019
People who need to attend an actual class in-person in order to focus and learn, and won't be able to focus and keep up with time management with online self-study courses.
RE: In your opinion, who should not earn a degree from the Big Three? - jsd - 04-13-2019
In some fields, pedigree still matters. Law is one of these fields, but if you use your Big 3 degree to go to a highly ranked law school no one will blink at your undergrad (though you won't have had the same networking links that traditional high-ranked undergrads had going in to law school. you'll certainly have the ability to network once you're in).
But other fields, say if you're looking at a Big 4 accounting firm or something, Big 3 wouldn't cut it. Of course, not accounting major is trying to get into a Big 4 firm....
It all goes back to what has been said a repeatedly on this forum -- Figure out the end goal and work backwards. Sometimes Big 3 just won't cut it. It serves most of our purposes just fine, but it's certainly not a blanket solution for everyone.
RE: In your opinion, who should not earn a degree from the Big Three? - clep3705 - 04-13-2019
Premed, predental, prenursing, physical sciences, engineering, etc. A well funded brick and mortar school will have laboratories where a lot of learning takes place interacting with the physical equipment. An education is just accumulating credits and checking off checkboxes. Some essential learning can only happen in the real world and that's not limited to vocational students.
RE: In your opinion, who should not earn a degree from the Big Three? - natshar - 04-13-2019
(04-13-2019, 09:07 AM)theclepexam Wrote: What are the main cases of students who probably shouldn't earn their degree from Excelsior, Thomas Edison, or Charter Oak?
Funny you mention that a lot of students actually. I've been thinking about this a lot and researching it. Turns out there is a lot.
There are exceptions, but think the big3 wouldn't be a good idea for...
1. Most high school seniors just graduating. If you want the traditional college experience, obviously the big 3 won't work. But since cost is mostly the issue, and time isn't for eighteen-year-olds. There a are a lot of other cheaper options than the big 3. Using a combination of community college, Clep/dsst/AP, living with parents and a cheap local university would probably grant a cheaper degree than the big 3, especially after financial aid. There are a multitude of scholarships available to high school seniors and many aren't that hard to get. I got a half-tuition scholarship at CC where I went after I graduated from a 2-minute app and apparently every applicant who met the GPA requirement got it. Once you are out of high school scholarships aren't as easy to get anymore. And if you don't know what you want to do with your life, getting a degree quickly in a year or won't put you in a better place. Going to college helps to figure out who you are and develop as a person. Plus you'll have connections and opportunities and maybe know how to use the degree after graduating.
2. Super high achieving high senior 4.0, super high test scores, valedictorian etc. You can get a full ride or close it to it at many low ranking colleges (just google colleges that give full tuition based on merit). And if you have the money, go to an elite school. And if your parents don't have money many elite schools don't make low-income students pay or get scholarships
3. If the circumstances make another option better. I knew someone with a lot of credits and I thought the big 3 would be perfect for them. Turns out a local university they only needed 30 credits (2 semesters) to finish their degree and work tuition reimbursement would cover it. The big 3 would probably take longer and be more money. Even if all the credits aligned for the degree, with the capstone/cornerstone and all that I don't think the degree could be granted quicker.
3. If you are someone with no experience and don't know many people. It is a well-known fact that most jobs and opportunities are found through networking. A professor at my college was known for saying "its not the degree that matters, its who you know and what you can do." If a big 3 grad doesn't have any skills or connections and has trouble building them they might be better at a B&M college. What good is a degree if you don't know how to use it? I know plenty of people with degrees working minimum wage jobs because they don't know how to move forward. Of course, going the traditional route doesn't prevent this, but B&M universities will give access to professors and other students who can help with networking and finding opportunities that the big 3 student self-studying won't have.
4. Anything "pre" Pre-med, pre-vet, pre-law, etc.
5. Any major that is more hands-on/vocational technical culinary arts, graphic design, video production, welding, etc.
6. If time and money aren't an issue at all when it comes to getting a degree.
7. If you have horrible time management skills and aren't self-motivated.
The list could go on...
Here is my (hypothetical) plan degree under 10k and under 2 years that works for where I live
Step 1: take 45 credits (15 exams) clep, dsst or ap
Step 2: take 30 credits at local cc. They offer self-paced and online 5 weeks among other flexible options, a dedicated student could possibly do 30 credits in a semester using these options. They accept up to 45 credits clep/dsst towards an associates degree.
Step 3: Earn AA and 3/1 articulation agreement with local state U. Many of the articulation agreements require 20-30 credits in electives so they aren't too hard to get with clep/dsst. All three universities that offer 3/1 agreements with the local CC accept up to 60 credits from clep/dsst applied to a degree.
Step 4: Take 30 credits at local state U.
Step 5: Graduate with BA/BS in under 2 years for under 10k and that's before pell grant/scholarships, reimbursement, etc. Other benefits you have 60 graded credits for law school or whatever you need. Plus access to professors, students, career centers, alumni groups and more.
The big 3 isn't for everyone. But anyone who wants to speed up their degree and/or cut costs should at least consider clep/dsst and ace/nccrs credit if their school takes it.
RE: In your opinion, who should not earn a degree from the Big Three? - dfrecore - 04-13-2019
I think it would be better to say who the Big 3 WOULD work for, since I think it's a shorter list: the person who has come to a point in their career where they need a degree to progress further than they can without a degree. They are probably at least 28, but anywhere up into their 50's. They've been working, and either 1) need a degree for a raise; 2) need a degree for a job they want; 3) need a degree for a promotion; or 4) need a degree to change careers.
I think most people who it works for are some step along this path.
RE: In your opinion, who should not earn a degree from the Big Three? - sanantone - 04-13-2019
I also think the Big 3 are a good option for people on a tight budget who can't take classes on campus. Night classes aren't convenient for everyone, and the same goes for day classes. Plus, people who choose to go to school part-time on campus have a low chance of graduating. Imagine balancing work and going to school for 6+ years.
For these people, going to school online is a better option, but many have made poor choices when selecting online programs and have accumulated large amounts of debt.
The Big 3 are just like any other unranked, nonprofit school. The real question is who should earn most of their credits via non-traditional methods.
RE: In your opinion, who should not earn a degree from the Big Three? - bjcheung77 - 04-13-2019
Basically, it boils down to the students responsibility on finding a school that will get them started on the right path, a Big 3/WGU or other CBP schools such as Brandman, NAU, etc are great for the undergrad offerings, but I would take up Grad Studies at a better or more known university.
The Big 3/WGU and other competency based programs are geared for Adults/Professionals, generally who have a family or other commitments and doesn't have the "time" to get into a class room.
As mentioned, these universities are are relatively unknown, unless you get a full ride scholarship to a school or you get into the Ivy Leagues, there is no reason to stay with the Big 3 or CBP schools.
Furthermore, the ones these aren't for are the ones who want to further get into a specific profession, as these schools do not offer every prerequisite course required for a variety of graduate degree requirements.
RE: In your opinion, who should not earn a degree from the Big Three? - cookderosa - 04-14-2019
(04-13-2019, 09:07 AM)theclepexam Wrote: What are the main cases of students who probably shouldn't earn their degree from Excelsior, Thomas Edison, or Charter Oak?
gosh yes!
Online degrees are fine for many fields, but of course you need hands on for many too, so that is the first criteria I'd use.
Second, if you have ZERO cash and are using financial aid, the Big 3 are a disaster. You'll be in huge student loan debt using financial aid (even with grants) taking 12-15 credits per semester. Additionally, you won't be able to qualify for freshman scholarships or merit scholarships - money that teens typically can tap into.
Third, the classes you need are not available for every major at all 3 schools- so you can't "just sign up" for any major. Transfer credit is REQUIRED for many degrees they offer - or I should say are "approved to award" but do not offer.
Fourth, you don't have the brain space to organize and plan the degree yourself. Since the real value of these degrees is when you DIY them, if you're not the DIY type, this is going to be awfully stressful.
To flip the script, I think there are 3 perfect reasons to earn a degree from one of the big 3.
First, you want a degree in business or liberal arts - nice and straightforward at all three schools.
Second, you plan to check the box and move onto bigger and better things- whether it's opening a business, mission work, military, already in a career, or a million other things, these degrees will do that for you.
Third, you only have or want to spend only about $10k for a degree. You can take a loan for your Cornerstone / Capstone if you need to, but you'll want to have some cash to get started because earning credits this way will cost cash.
Another perk, though not a reason, is that you don't need to take the SAT or ACT - the colleges are open enrollment, so 100% admission. Just sign up!