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+--- Thread: Free community college for everyone? We can all be Aric Hall! (/Thread-Free-community-college-for-everyone-We-can-all-be-Aric-Hall)
Free community college for everyone? We can all be Aric Hall! - sanantone - 01-09-2015
Okay. I'm sensationalizing this. I found out about this on the other forum. Obama is proposing free community college for everyone, and I'm sure there will be limits on how many degrees can be earned and restrictions for those who already have higher degrees. Although, this could possibly allow those with less marketable degrees to train in more marketable fields.
Obama to propose two free years of community college for students - Allie Grasgreen - POLITICO
But, what if community colleges were free for everyone? It won't get me closer to my goal of beating Michael Nicholson's 22 master's degrees, but I could beat Aric Hall's 14 associate's degrees! I would do things differently, though. I wouldn't earn multiple degrees in virtually the same majors like he did.
Aric W Hall* -* Resume* -* Education* -* -* -*
Here is my wishlist for associate's degrees.
Polysomnography
Nursing
Veterinary Technology
Surgical Technology
Radiography
Occupational Therapy Assistant
Physical Therapy Assistant
Medical Laboratory Technology
Criminal Justice with Peace Officer Certification Sequence
Fire Science with Firefighter Training
Culinary Arts
Paralegal Studies
Automotive Technology
I'll think of some more later. I already have an AAS and am working on an ASNSM.
Free community college for everyone? We can all be Aric Hall! - videogamesrock - 01-09-2015
I really hope there will be a cap on what the CC's can charge the federal government . I hope this isn't a blank check program where we find out down the road that they are charging $500 a credit to the federal government.
Free community college for everyone? We can all be Aric Hall! - sanantone - 01-09-2015
Obama wants to cover 3/4 of the cost and convince states to cover the remaining 1/4. With that, I think the CCs would be forced to keep their costs down. They are already subsidized by state and local governments.
Free community college for everyone? We can all be Aric Hall! - videogamesrock - 01-09-2015
I prefer to have a cap with no more than 3% increases in tuition for inflation. This smells very similar to the ACA. I do not believe there are caps for insurance companies either (correct me if I'm wrong).
There was someone on this board who said that the community colleges in 1989 were charging around $11 a credit, and due to the very easy (believe me I know) student loans, the cost of tuition exploded. In fact $11 in 1989 is worth around $21 today. That tells me the rate of inflation with colleges is much higher with all of that free money floating around. Many CC's are charging $85 and above.
However, if this is true and the program would implement caps, this could be a very wonderful thing.
Oh and I love the 17 Associates Degrees.
Free community college for everyone? We can all be Aric Hall! - sanantone - 01-09-2015
There are no caps with ACA, but the government is not covering the complete cost of insurance. The government is giving subsidies based on a person's income. That would be more akin to giving someone a grant based on income. It would be up to the person to choose where her or she wants to spend his or her money and grant.
I know that community colleges in California used to be free. They are now free to high school students who meet the criteria in Tennessee. Tennessee's new law apparently inspired Obama. Oregon was considering something similar, but I don't know what happened with that.
There are two ways this could go. Congress could reject this in favor of having states come up with their own solutions, or they could support it because it streamlines financial aid. I'm thinking the former is more likely.
Free community college for everyone? We can all be Aric Hall! - Yanji - 01-09-2015
Something needs to be done to improve college affordability and quality, but I don't think free tuition is the right solution. France has great public education, but staggering university dropout rates, partly due to the fact that it's free. Some skin in the game helps prevent 18-19 year old students from not caring at all, which many of them would be tempted to do. In addition, if CC is free, I fear it would essentially become an extension of high school, which is the last thing anyone needs.
Of OECD countries, Canada has the highest percentage of adults over 25 with degrees at something like 52%. ("degree" here is defined as a Bachelor's degree or higher) College isn't free in Canada, but tuition is generally lower than US state schools. I'm not advocating any country's specific system, but I think this at least proves that college does not need to be free to be accessible, which is presumably the point of Pres. Obama's proposal. I'm actually disappointed by this announcement, because I think the country could use an education legacy from the Obama presidency, but this proposal is unlikely to make it through Congress and even if it did, would have doubtful positive social impact, before you even consider the financial implications.
Free community college for everyone? We can all be Aric Hall! - SwaggyP - 01-09-2015
videogamesrock Wrote:I prefer to have a cap with no more than 3% increases in tuition for inflation. This smells very similar to the ACA. I do not believe there are caps for insurance companies either (correct me if I'm wrong).
There was someone on this board who said that the community colleges in 1989 were charging around $11 a credit, and due to the very easy (believe me I know) student loans, the cost of tuition exploded. In fact $11 in 1989 is worth around $21 today. That tells me the rate of inflation with colleges is much higher with all of that free money floating around. Many CC's are charging $85 and above.
However, if this is true and the program would implement caps, this could be a very wonderful thing.
My county CC charges $113 per credit, and $140 per credit for on-line courses. So when I looked at the $175 per credit under enrolled options at TESC, I was pleasantly surprised and it made the decision easier to cease taking CC classes in favor of TESC UL courses.
I'm personally not a big fan of this proposal, it's simply adding the 13th and 14th grade after HS for students. And anytime something becomes free, it's also devalued. Higher education should be affordable to the masses; but education also offers professional and personal enrichment; and there should be a cost associated with gaining that. What I would like to see is at least 30-45 General Education College Credit hours earned in HS through classes during Jr. and Sr. years. Not dissimilar to AP, but minus the exam and limited selection process; students should be graduating HS with an equivalent of CC level general studies anyways; College should be about learning specialized knowledge- I think a lot more people would finish under that scenario. If everybody graduated HS 1/4 complete in pursuit of a BA/BS, it would make it financially reasonable to continue their studies and keep students motivated by knowing their within reach. Our system of 4 years of college post HS to get a degree is an exception rather then the rule when compared to most of the world.
Free community college for everyone? We can all be Aric Hall! - sanantone - 01-09-2015
The best argument against this is that low-income students already qualify for the Pell Grant, and that's more than enough to cover the tuition at most community colleges. The only thing that will change is that middle class families won't have to worry about CC tuition and can save money on 4 years of schooling. CCs already have high dropout rates. LOL. However, the exact numbers don't tell the story because many leave CCs before graduating and transfer their credits to 4-year schools. I call this a success. CCs are kind of already are an extension of high school, too. I don't know if this is still the case, but half of the students entering the CCs in San Antonio need remedial courses.
Free community college for everyone? We can all be Aric Hall! - videogamesrock - 01-09-2015
SwaggyP Wrote:My county CC charges $113 per credit, and $140 per credit for on-line courses. So when I looked at the $175 per credit under enrolled options at TESC, I was pleasantly surprised and it made the decision easier to cease taking CC classes in favor of TESC UL courses.
I'm personally not a big fan of this proposal, it's simply adding the 13th and 14th grade after HS for students. And anytime something becomes free, it's also devalued. Higher education should be affordable to the masses; but education also offers professional and personal enrichment; and there should be a cost associated with gaining that. What I would like to see is at least 30-45 General Education College Credit hours earned in HS through classes during Jr. and Sr. years. Not dissimilar to AP, but minus the exam and limited selection process; students should be graduating HS with an equivalent of CC level general studies anyways; College should be about learning specialized knowledge- I think a lot more people would finish under that scenario. If everybody graduated HS 1/4 complete in pursuit of a BA/BS, it would make it financially reasonable to continue their studies and keep students motivated by knowing their within reach. Our system of 4 years of college post HS to get a degree is an exception rather then the rule when compared to most of the world.
I agree it is an extension of HS. Majority of my class mates have a very difficult time writing and comprehending the assignments. These are students who will need to take three 90 level English courses before they can even take Eng 101. However, it appears to me that the sociology courses that are mostly writing intensive do not have a writing requirement.
Free community college for everyone? We can all be Aric Hall! - videogamesrock - 01-09-2015
sanantone Wrote:The best argument against this is that low-income students already qualify for the Pell Grant, and that's more than enough to cover the tuition at most community colleges. The only thing that will change is that middle class families won't have to worry about CC tuition and can save money on 4 years of schooling. CCs already have high dropout rates. LOL. However, the exact numbers don't tell the story because many leave CCs before graduating and transfer their credits to 4-year schools. I call this a success. CCs are kind of already are an extension of high school, too. I don't know if this is still the case, but half of the students entering the CCs in San Antonio need remedial courses.
It is true that many students transfer out before graduating. My wife completed her prerequisites for nursing and simply transferred out. Many of the students in her cohort share the same story.