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Older students and the liberal arts - Scholar Interrupted - 04-20-2011
This article from Town Hall (full disclosure: I'm not a liberal) got me thinking. The article lists a few questions and answers from a recent sociology exam, and the questions bear an obvious and significant anti-US bias. Those of you on the left may believe the bias is justified. But I don't think anyone could deny that the bias is there and the questions are not designed to elicit original thought by the student.
I took sociology more than 20 years ago, and it wasn't anything like what the article describes. But, as an over-40 EC history major, I did take some EC courses as well as ECEs in the social sciences (history and foreign policy), and there were times when material from my textbooks gave me pause. Sometimes something I read seemed like half the story, or at least slanted, and I would make a mental note to seek information from other sources one day when I had time. Other times, in writing papers and responding to exam essay questions, I felt I should refrain from expressing any opinion that might not jibe with the instructor's lest it affect my grade.
I wonder if anyone else has had similar experiences as an adult liberal arts major. It's one thing to be 19 years old, away from mom and dad for the first time, and have this distinguished instructor standing on an ivory pedestal telling you how you should view the world. It's quite another to be returning to school in your 30s or 40s, bringing your well-informed, carefully-considered, and oh-so-middle-class opinions with you.
Older students and the liberal arts - alleycat - 04-20-2011
Scholar Interrupted Wrote:This article from Town Hall (full disclosure: I'm not a liberal) got me thinking. The article lists a few questions and answers from a recent sociology exam, and the questions bear an obvious and significant anti-US bias. Those of you on the left may believe the bias is justified. But I don't think anyone could deny that the bias is there and the questions are not designed to elicit original thought by the student.
I took sociology more than 20 years ago, and it wasn't anything like what the article describes. But, as an over-40 EC history major, I did take some EC courses as well as ECEs in the social sciences (history and foreign policy), and there were times when material from my textbooks gave me pause. Sometimes something I read seemed like half the story, or at least slanted, and I would make a mental note to seek information from other sources one day when I had time. Other times, in writing papers and responding to exam essay questions, I felt I should refrain from expressing any opinion that might not jibe with the instructor's lest it affect my grade.
I wonder if anyone else has had similar experiences as an adult liberal arts major. It's one thing to be 19 years old, away from mom and dad for the first time, and have this distinguished instructor standing on an ivory pedestal telling you how you should view the world. It's quite another to be returning to school in your 30s or 40s, bringing your well-informed, carefully-considered, and oh-so-middle-class opinions with you.
My take on it is that as an older (over forty and fabulous) student that I could get away with so much more then the younger students in class. They actually noticed. I have taken many B&M classes and I feel that many of my professors noticed I wasn't 19 and noticed that I actually had a little life experience to back it up. I had one instructor that was OLD (I mean old) and she could not stand anyone's opinion but her own. Thank heavens she is gone now. I mean that for the new students coming into the program behind me. But she was a bit controlling with her behavior. Probably because of her underlying personality disorder. But as far as the rest of them went I actually think I had it easier then the young students.
Older students and the liberal arts - P00057870 - 04-20-2011
As someone who is approaching 60, I have to agree with what you have said but also can add that the history books are being rewritten. I also have read things in texts that did not jive with what I had learned and/or lived through, made that mental note you refer to and gone back to research the specific occurrent. I often found that the facts being taught were NOT correct or presented in a slanted view point and, rarely, when the information available at the time perhaps did not tell the whole story and those facts can now be seen in a broader view - but, overall, that was extremely rare. Perhaps once or twice at the most.
Since I work in a school, I hear many younger people talking and realize that they see our country through different eyes than my generation di, and I suspect it may not lead them or our country on a good path. They are more inclined to think in an "entitlement" view point. Someone (government) owes them something. I have had to remind them that we are the people who will be paying for this, the government only taxes us and redistributes what we have worked so very hard to earn.
Glad to know others have noticed some of these changes.
Older students and the liberal arts - OE800_85 - 04-20-2011
I think by exposing this bias you're being biased yourself. Who's to say what you learnt 20 years ago, or through your own limited personal experience, is right? I mean, I hate when teachers indoctrinate, but there are also people who try to indoctrinate a conflicting viewpoint. I was kind of an ass in class, I loved to disagree with teachers, from grade 3 onwards. Sometimes I was right, sometimes I was wrong, most of the time we had differing opinions on that. However I don't like the implication...are you saying we can't criticize America? America's NEVER done anything wrong? If you wanna impose ideas like that on professors I think we may as well adorn the swastika as our flag.
This is the free world, buddy. If you disagree with your professor, go right ahead, present your sources, make your argument, let your opinion be heard. If your prof is an educator worthy of any respect, he/she will appreciate your analysis, and perhaps you can engage each other and have a little debate. That's what being free is all about.
We all know History is written by the winners, and I'm sure there's bias in every section of every History book, it's impossible to be truly objective. In my opinion History is not about memorizing facts, it's about analysis, providing evidence in support of an argument about it. Otherwise I think it's a waste of time to learn dates/names.
**edit: Upon reading the article, I know what you mean, but it's also possible this was taken out of context. In sociology you're often analyzing the works of some authors, the teacher isn't necessarily presenting these opinions on her own, but the questions could have merely been a reading comprehension of the text, not necessarily a statement of some fact or figure
As well, it might be a little unfair, but who's to say this information is even true? There's no confirmation, as far as I'm concerned it could be hearsay. I hate when information is presented without evidence. Just exploring the possibilities we perhaps haven't thought about
Older students and the liberal arts - ryoder - 04-21-2011
Sociology at USF is a decided ultra liberal program. A liberal friend of mine's roommate has a bachelors in sociology and when he began the masters he realized that not only was it anti-american it was anti white male. He ended up leaving the program.
There is a strong push from the far left into the school system. The communist party realized that education was the best way to create the future central planners and anti-capitalists.
Education is the battleground of thought and the left is winning.
If I had time I would cite some excellent references on classes like "anti-racist math" which attempt to remove the white fathers of mathematics due to that being racist. It is alarming how education in this country is changing to political indoctrination.
The rest of the world doesn't even teach liberal arts in college. Ask any Indian how their BS went and it will be all technology or professional classes. There is zero liberal arts education after high school and they are kicking our buts in technology.
Older students and the liberal arts - MA2 - 04-21-2011
ryoder Wrote:Sociology at USF is a decided ultra liberal program. A liberal friend of mine's roommate has a bachelors in sociology and when he began the masters he realized that not only was it anti-american it was anti white male. He ended up leaving the program.
That's ok though, liberals hate America, and being a racist is acceptable, but only if it is towards white men. Don't say affirmative action is racist or you'll get fired!
Older students and the liberal arts - Shemrat - 04-21-2011
ryoder Wrote:The rest of the world doesn't even teach liberal arts in college. Ask any Indian how their BS went and it will be all technology or professional classes. There is zero liberal arts education after high school and they are kicking our buts in technology.
The U.S. is outsourcing to them, but by no means are they dominant in a technological perspective. Please offer me some proof.
Japan and Finland make more sense to me.
Older students and the liberal arts - MA2 - 04-21-2011
Shemrat Wrote:The U.S. is outsourcing to them, but by no means are they dominant in a technological perspective. Please offer me some proof.
You want proof that Japan or China is beating us badly when it comes to technology and education? Look around for your proof.
Older students and the liberal arts - Shemrat - 04-21-2011
MA2 Wrote:You want proof that Japan or China is beating us badly when it comes to technology and education? Look around for your proof.
I did not mention Japan. I did, however, edit before I read your post indicating my view on Japanese technology.
Older students and the liberal arts - Lyanne - 04-21-2011
ITA agree Scholar. I took an anthropology class in seat and had to sit there while the professor lectured from a stance of extreme bias. I had the same thoughts as you, that I'm older and know not to accept his views and opinions as fact, but I worried about the 19 year olds.
Luckily there were quite a few older students in the class who weren't afraid to raise their hand and challenge some of his views.