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+--- Thread: Is It Worth the Money to Get a College Degree? Lets Do the Math and Find Out! (/Thread-Is-It-Worth-the-Money-to-Get-a-College-Degree-Lets-Do-the-Math-and-Find-Out)
RE: Is It Worth the Money to Get a College Degree? Lets Do the Math and Find Out! - spohara - 02-06-2023
(02-05-2023, 10:19 PM)ss20ts Wrote:(02-05-2023, 07:48 PM)dfrecore Wrote: Truth - to say that everyone is living paycheck-to-paycheck based solely on the cost of living - I doubt that. Many just live on more than they make on a regular basis.
Nowhere did I say everyone. I said the majority of the US live paycheck to paycheck which isn't everyone just the majority. There are plenty of stats that back this up.
I think we all agree most live paycheck to paycheck, but maybe disagree on the reason? To me, if you're making $20k more than someone who is living paycheck to paycheck and all else is equal, you're living paycheck to paycheck because of your own choices.
RE: Is It Worth the Money to Get a College Degree? Lets Do the Math and Find Out! - ss20ts - 02-06-2023
(02-06-2023, 11:05 AM)spohara Wrote: I think we all agree most live paycheck to paycheck, but maybe disagree on the reason? To me, if you're making $20k more than someone who is living paycheck to paycheck and all else is equal, you're living paycheck to paycheck because of your own choices.
Location is a huge factor in the differences in the cost of living. Living paycheck to paycheck is really about covering the daily living expenses. It doesn't mean someone is driving a new Bentley or taking a month long vacation in Europe.
RE: Is It Worth the Money to Get a College Degree? Lets Do the Math and Find Out! - spohara - 02-06-2023
(02-06-2023, 01:22 PM)ss20ts Wrote:(02-06-2023, 11:05 AM)spohara Wrote: I think we all agree most live paycheck to paycheck, but maybe disagree on the reason? To me, if you're making $20k more than someone who is living paycheck to paycheck and all else is equal, you're living paycheck to paycheck because of your own choices.
Location is a huge factor in the differences in the cost of living. Living paycheck to paycheck is really about covering the daily living expenses. It doesn't mean someone is driving a new Bentley or taking a month long vacation in Europe.
I seriously doubt that all college grads are living in high cost areas and all non-college grads are living in low cost areas. But maybe! If that's the case, then there really is no point in a college degree, just live in a low cost area without one, and live paycheck to paycheck just like you would with a degree.
RE: Is It Worth the Money to Get a College Degree? Lets Do the Math and Find Out! - ss20ts - 02-06-2023
(02-06-2023, 01:32 PM)spohara Wrote: I seriously doubt that all college grads are living in high cost areas and all non-college grads are living in low cost areas. But maybe! If that's the case, then there really is no point in a college degree, just live in a low cost area without one, and live paycheck to paycheck just like you would with a degree.
What are you talking about? No one said all college grads live anywhere. Good grief. Low cost areas typically have lower wages as well. Plenty of college grads are making minimum wage. Even that will vary by state and even city to city in some states.
RE: Is It Worth the Money to Get a College Degree? Lets Do the Math and Find Out! - HogwartsSchool - 02-06-2023
Something people never think about is state and federal taxes. Someone can be making a high salary but live in a high cost area with high state income taxes. Thus, become paycheck to paycheck, with or without a degree. A high salary in one state is not equal to a high salary in another state. Context is vital. Unfortunately, governments have not taken into account certain high cost of living states, talking to you California and New York.
RE: Is It Worth the Money to Get a College Degree? Lets Do the Math and Find Out! - spohara - 02-06-2023
(02-06-2023, 04:10 PM)ss20ts Wrote:(02-06-2023, 01:32 PM)spohara Wrote: I seriously doubt that all college grads are living in high cost areas and all non-college grads are living in low cost areas. But maybe! If that's the case, then there really is no point in a college degree, just live in a low cost area without one, and live paycheck to paycheck just like you would with a degree.
What are you talking about? No one said all college grads live anywhere. Good grief. Low cost areas typically have lower wages as well. Plenty of college grads are making minimum wage. Even that will vary by state and even city to city in some states.
Then what case are you trying to make? If it isn't just the college grads living in the expensive areas, and they make $20k more than the non-college grads who are living in the same area, why are the college grads forced to live paycheck to paycheck?
RE: Is It Worth the Money to Get a College Degree? Lets Do the Math and Find Out! - rachel83az - 02-07-2023
There are different degrees of living paycheck-to-paycheck, ones that don't necessarily require the higher earner to be careless with money.
Example:
Bottom rung - you live in a dingy studio apartment. The kind where the landlord does repairs slowly, if at all. You're lucky to have hot water on some days. Dirty laundry needs to be hauled to the laundromat. You have to take a lengthy bus ride to get anywhere. Work is an hour away. The grocery store is an hour on the bus in another direction.
Next tier - You earn a bit more, so now you're able to live in a 1-bedroom apartment that actually has utilities available 24/7. Washer/dryer are in-unit, but you must buy them. Or haul your clothes to the laundromat still. Your job is even further away, but now you have a car you make payments on. Grocery store: ditto. You're only barely above subsistence level, but you're still living paycheck to paycheck.
RE: Is It Worth the Money to Get a College Degree? Lets Do the Math and Find Out! - dfrecore - 02-08-2023
(02-07-2023, 01:48 AM)rachel83az Wrote: There are different degrees of living paycheck-to-paycheck, ones that don't necessarily require the higher earner to be careless with money.
Example:
Bottom rung - you live in a dingy studio apartment. The kind where the landlord does repairs slowly, if at all. You're lucky to have hot water on some days. Dirty laundry needs to be hauled to the laundromat. You have to take a lengthy bus ride to get anywhere. Work is an hour away. The grocery store is an hour on the bus in another direction.
Next tier - You earn a bit more, so now you're able to live in a 1-bedroom apartment that actually has utilities available 24/7. Washer/dryer are in-unit, but you must buy them. Or haul your clothes to the laundromat still. Your job is even further away, but now you have a car you make payments on. Grocery store: ditto. You're only barely above subsistence level, but you're still living paycheck to paycheck.
There are more levels than those 2:
Another tier - you make good make good money, but live in a very trendy area so that you can walk to restaurants and bars. You go out many nights a week with friends, and eat out almost every meal. You have a nice little car, with car payments. You put zero money away because you spend every dime and then some. I was this person when I was young and single. I had LOTS of friends in this boat with me.
Another tier - you make good money, and work from home so you can live anywhere; instead of choosing somewhere "reasonable" based on your income, you choose a VERY expensive city to "treat yourself" after living somewhere crappy the last couple of years due to some circumstances. Then you complain about how small your apartment is and how expensive it is to live here. You put no money away because you "can't afford it." I have a friend here right now, no matter what advice I give, she ignores it. We make more than 2x her income, yet when she bought a new W/D a few years ago, she chose the most expensive pair in the store. I was shocked, and said "wow, that's a lot of money, are you sure you don't want something cheaper?" and her response was "I want something nice." Alrighty then. I have plenty of other friends who make bad choices on a regular basis and then are shocked that things don't turn out that great.
Another tier - you make VERY good money. You live in a VERY nice neighborhood. Your neighbors all have the nicest of cars, most cars are in the $75k+ range. You own multiple toys - golf cart, ATV, guns, etc. You go on very nice vacations several times a year. Europe, Asia, the Caribbean, Disneyworld, and stay at expensive resorts. You spend a LOT of money on looking good - $400 per haircut monthly, $40 nails each week, $60 pedicures every couple of weeks, new clothes on a regular basis from upscale stores. You put away very little money because you spend almost every dime you make. I know people like this as well. I avoid this type of scene because I'm not into keeping up with the Joneses, nor do I want to spend myself into bankruptcy. It is very hard to keep up in an area like this.
There are a LOT of reasons people live paycheck-to-paycheck, and it's not always because the paycheck is too small. I've known WAY more people that make decent or more than decent money that live p2p than people who are totally broke because they make no money. WAY more. Like 50-to-1.
RE: Is It Worth the Money to Get a College Degree? Lets Do the Math and Find Out! - davewill - 02-08-2023
(02-08-2023, 12:54 PM)dfrecore Wrote: There are a LOT of reasons people live paycheck-to-paycheck, and it's not always because the paycheck is too small. I've known WAY more people that make decent or more than decent money that live p2p than people who are totally broke because they make no money. WAY more. Like 50-to-1.
You left out those who lived BEYOND their means, and now are living paycheck to paycheck because their debts consume too much of their income.
I would add that except at the very lowest levels of poverty, people COULD choose to save at some rate (2%,10%), build some savings and NOT live p2p, they just don't.
RE: Is It Worth the Money to Get a College Degree? Lets Do the Math and Find Out! - dfrecore - 02-08-2023
(02-08-2023, 01:27 PM)davewill Wrote:(02-08-2023, 12:54 PM)dfrecore Wrote: There are a LOT of reasons people live paycheck-to-paycheck, and it's not always because the paycheck is too small. I've known WAY more people that make decent or more than decent money that live p2p than people who are totally broke because they make no money. WAY more. Like 50-to-1.
You left out those who lived BEYOND their means, and now are living paycheck to paycheck because their debts consume too much of their income.
I would add that except at the very lowest levels of poverty, people COULD choose to save at some rate (2%,10%), build some savings and NOT live p2p, they just don't.
Ah, yes - I only listed an additional 3 tiers, knowing that people would know of others.
I will tell you that my kids are a great example of living within your means. Both kids have worked 30-40 hours a week since summer of 2020; one has worked more consistently, but the other has always made more per hour. They both have paid-for cars, so no bills; one started paying for car insurance in 2021, the other in 2022. Since 2020, one has made more than the other overall, and managed to save 90% of their take-home pay, while the other spent most of what they made (doesn't help that he got 1 ticket and 2 minor accidents so his auto insurance is through the roof, but that's all about choices in how you drive). She's 20 and is looking at buying a house, while he is 19 and is decidedly NOT going to be buying anything any time soon. Between driving issues and spending like an idiot, he has exactly nothing saved, not even for a rainy day (like, if he has car trouble). She has a car maintenance fund, a car fund (for a purchase if she needs to), a school fund (if something comes up that she has to pay for immediately until she gets reimbursed), and a house fund.
I can tell you right now, she will ALWAYS squirrel away money, and ALWAYS have money sitting there in case of an emergency, and ALWAYS put money in her 401(k) (she's not yet old enough to join). And he MAY learn to save, but it won't be the same; he's going to count on MAKING a lot of money so that he can spend a lot. That's the plan anyway.
They both had the same opportunity to save money (both lived at home with 90% of expenses paid for). But one did and the other did not. I would imagine this is how it is with lots of people - they don't make choices that pan out in the long run and then say "I live paycheck-to-paycheck because it's impossible not to."