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+--- Thread: End of the University as we know it? (/Thread-End-of-the-University-as-we-know-it)
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End of the University as we know it? - marianne202 - 12-16-2012
Actually, when I was enrolled in EC's nursing program, everything was totally online (exam based) except a 3 day on-site clinical exam. You had to have come sort of clinical experience, I was an EMT but I was able to do all my nursing and gen ed coursework via testing. No classroom time was required. There are a few other schools that do the same thing. There are phenomenal 3D DVD and live cadaver labs you can watch that make you feel like you are there, just without the smell! Technology has come a long way. Will a program such as cosmotology ever be totally online? No, but portions could be offered online with some of the work being done via a webcam then proficiency testing on-site for the skills observed via internet. I do see a huge increase in technology delivered instruction, however, those without access to technology or without the skills to self-teach or to be disciplined enough to self-teach will be unable to take advantage of this technology. As such I do believe some schools will always be available for this group of students, however the courses and programs offered will be limited. Some in education are very afraid of these types of changes especially those who don't embrace or use technology themselves. Education is evolving, time will tell if it is for the better or worse. All we can do is hold on and enjoy the ride!
End of the University as we know it? - Snickerdoodle - 12-16-2012
marianne202 Wrote:There are phenomenal 3D DVD and live cadaver labs you can watch that make you feel like you are there, just without the smell! Technology has come a long way.
I'm a pre-health sciences student, and I just finished taking human anatomy & physiology. A virtual lab was included with my textbook. I was not comfortable studying for labs by sitting at home in front of my computer. It's not so neat and pretty (or smell-free) in real life, and I'd feel ill-prepared if I had relied solely on the virtual resources, much as I love online classes. To be clear, I'm speaking only about lab science classes. Granted, I feel my intro to chem B&M courses have lousy labs---half of the time, the experiments turn out differently, and our professor ends up saying, "Um, it should be green....but yeah, it's blue." hilarious
End of the University as we know it? - clep3705 - 12-16-2012
marianne202 Wrote:Actually, when I was enrolled in EC's nursing program, everything was totally online (exam based) except a 3 day on-site clinical exam. You had to have come sort of clinical experience, I was an EMT but I was able to do all my nursing and gen ed coursework via testing. No classroom time was required.
You had prior clinical experience. With no clinical experience, you can't do nursing online. I am aware of the process you went through. I don't think it is accepted in all states. Regardless, not all hospitals will hire you based on this alone, although some will. Just because an online program with a clinical test at the end meets the legal requirements in some jurisdictions doesn't mean it is accepted everywhere.
End of the University as we know it? - sanantone - 12-17-2012
I didn't have time to read the whole article thoroughly, but I disagree with the author's logic. He pretty much states that most of the elite universities will stick around while other universities won't because the mid-tier universities won't be able to compete due to differences in prestige. Basically, more people will go for open source programs at Harvard because of its name than Texas Tech, for example. My argument is that the Ivy League schools and other elite universities will lose their prestige when they let everyone complete programs at their schools. There's no telling how it would affect their endowments. My guess is that prestigious universities will protect their names by sticking with titles like Harvardx or MITx. Employers will know the difference. If they don't stick with this naming model, employers will still be able to tell the difference between those who completed courses or certificate programs from an open source project and those who had to go through the rigorous admissions process in order to get into a degree program. Harvard puts "extension studies" on the diplomas of those who graduate from Harvard Extension. They even tell you it's improper to list Harvard University on your resume without mentioning extension studies in your degree. I'd much rather have Texas Tech, MA in Psychology on my resume than Harvard University, Master of Liberal Arts in Extension Studies, Concentration in Psychology.
End of the University as we know it? - Daithi - 12-17-2012
I disagree, at least at the undergraduate level. Even with the word "Extension" tacked on I'd rather have on my resume
_
[INDENT]Harvard University Extension
Bachelor of Arts in Liberal Studies[/INDENT]
_
over
_
[INDENT]Poduck University
Bachelor of Arts in Liberal Studies[/INDENT]
_
The other point the author makes is one of cost. If it costs me $10,000 for the online BA degree from Harvard and $100,000 for a butt-in-seat degree from Texas Tech then I'd still rather have the Harvard degree.
End of the University as we know it? - Daithi - 12-17-2012
One more thing---
If Harvard, Stanford, or MIT started offering an online Bachelors, I don't think it would be easy to earn this degree. The Harvard Extension campus requires students to earn As and Bs in their courses, and those courses aren't easy. I can get an online degree from TESC and test out of nearly every class and never have to take a course like calculus or chemistry. I imagine that this would not be the case for an online degree from one of the elite schools. I imagine that if you earned an online degree from one of the elites that it would still be damn hard. I imagine that most of the people who tried would not succeed, and the elites would use this fact to maintain their prestige.
End of the University as we know it? - sanantone - 12-17-2012
I don't think employers would understand it that way. They will see you as attending the division of the school that's easy to get into and not really the same as attending the actual school. For the employers who still discriminate against distance learning degrees, I think they'd rather see podunk college than some open enrollment, distance-only school. "Extension Studies" just sounds so degrading, but I know Harvard is doing this for a reason. If they really saw these students as being on the same level as other Harvard students, they wouldn't put "extension studies" on their diplomas. There are other schools with distance education divisions that do not differentiate between their students.
I have no first-hand experience taking courses at any of these elite schools, but I know some of them engage in grade inflation. Exclusivity does not equal difficulty. Anyway, I'm sure the elite universities would not want to hurt their excellent retention and graduation rates. That would be another reason to keep extension studies and other distance learning divisions like it separate.
Now that I think about it, it would be insulting for me to complete the same courses as everyone else and having to put extension studies on my resume. Once there are millions of people graduating with credentials from these schools in the future, as this article would suggest, they would lose their prestige. There would be nothing special about being an MIT graduate once their are hundreds of thousands of them flooding the market. If their courses are too difficult for most to pass, wouldn't there still be a market for them at lower-tiered schools?
End of the University as we know it? - OE800_85 - 12-18-2012
I think you have to understand this change by tier. I see schools today as perhaps 4 tiers. The elite, the very good (still difficult to get into and you should be proud of going to), the average (probably 80% of all schools, and the horrible degree mills.
The first tier will never change. Top schools will continue to open up their programs and allow online entrants, but they'll never be the same as their real graduates. There's a reason people fight to get into those schools.
The fourth tier is a joke and perhaps they shouldn't be called schools.
The third tier is where the big 3 live. They have proper accreditation, reasonable reputation, and satisfy what most students need from a degree. These schools have already changed a lot.
I think the second tier is their next target. Some reasonably good schools that want to stand out from the pack could start offering much more flexible programs to the public in the near future.