interesting info on TESC website

[cookderosa]

So, let me apologize in advance for not knowing how to link you to where I'm reading from. You can go there yourself by going to TESC dot edu, type in "Straighterline" in the search function box and read the second resource. It's a power point pdf. (which has nothing to do with SL)

Slide 23:
a graph showing breakdown of Charter Oak graduates for this past year. They graduated 310 students, only 176 took ONE OR MORE credit by exam tests! The average credit earned by THOSE students was 17.64 credits.

So, the assumption that everyone is testing out of their entire degree is flat wrong! In fact, only half are even taking a test! I completed 4 terms of classes at TESC ranging from 2-4 classes each term, and I'd shared before that in "my" classes (and the student forums) there were VERY FEW students using credit by exam methods. I know a few others here have shared similar experiences. I remember one member "L" said the person near her at graduation even criticized allllllll her testing credit.

I wanted to share this because it gives a tiny bit of data to support the experience of some of us who really felt like most students who attend the big 3 are -in fact- traditionally completing a degree. This is important because sometimes there is the presumption that if you enroll at one of the big 3, you're automatically categorized to be a "test-outter" or some other label that seems unsavory. So, this is good news!

[sanantone]

As one can tell from my signature, I did not test out of most of my degree. I applied to the Big 3 because I needed to transfer a lot of credits from 4 different schools and I did not want to deal with residency requirements either. I wish I would have known about these schools years ago. I would have tested out of more courses and saved a lot of time and money.

The reasons why I believe most Big 3 attendees don't fully utilize CBEs are because
1. They don't know about them.
2. A lot of people are afraid of high stakes testing.

[NAP]

Interesting find! Excelsior College has several thousand graduates every year. I have also gotten the feeling that using credit-by-exam is more unusual than I would like it to be. I agree that the issues Sanantone brought up are obstacles to this.

[clep3705]

The PowerPoint slides can be directly accessed here: https://www.google.com/url?q=http://www....KiTGBXsQBQ

[Daithi]

WOW! This is shocking to me. My assumption was that most students, at least in the online environment, were testing out of classes. It is too bad that more aren't taking advantage of this option.

When I was in high school, a long time ago, I took my first computer programming course. At the time, I didn't know the difference between a computer and a microwave. I really had know idea what a computer was used for --- like I said, it was a long time ago. I'd only taken the course because I was afraid of taking trig. I was completely lost in class. The textbook wasn't much help either. Eventually, I went to the library and got another book on programming. I basically used this book to teach myself how to program. I loved it. I spent hours writing programs into notebooks when I was supposed to be learning chemistry, English, etc. I also spent hours debugging code that I had written but wasn't working correctly. My code was too complicated to ask for help from the teacher, so I had no choice but to solve the problems myself. This was real learning. I've now been working as a software developer for over 30 years.

It was later in life that realized I could learn anything like I had learned how to program. I didn't need to sit in a classroom and listen to a teacher lecturing in order to learn. Based on my own personal experience, I find learning on my own is far more effective. It is the students who need a teacher to walk them through the learning process who are really shorting themselves. They have to sit through material they already know as the teacher tries to get all the students on the same page. They need to sit through instruction aimed at the middle of the class even if they could go quicker (or need to go slower). If the instructor mentions something they find interesting there is no guarantee the instructor can go into details because of time constraints. When you struggle with something and are eventually able to figure out the answer on your own, you will remember it forever. Having a teacher prod you to the answer simply isn't the same thing.

[Demo18cc]

Only 18 of my 120 Soon to be completed BSLS are from testing and they are free. I think most enjoy at least some classroom time.

[ryoder]

The people in my TESC courses didn't know about CLEP. I asked them when filling out my hello to the class discussion forum post. I even pointed out this site.

[scorched]

This doesn't surprise me, most colleges do not want you to know you don't really need them, except to confer the degree "officially".

And everyone at work I ever talk to about completing my degree, they ask how I handle taking classes with working and flying all over the world.
After I tell them for I don't take classes, they get the quizzical look, and I have to explain that for example CLEP test were founded in 1967 and have been accepted at major universities since before I originally went to college in 1989. And that if I know the typical class material, I can basically show up and take a final exam. Then explain I just keep pdf based study material on my laptop, or access IC through the web to study, get home take a test and out pops college credit.
It just amazes them this can be done, which for my IT profession is funny because I, along with hundreds of thousands of other people, have been taking computer based certifications since the mid 90s.

And it really is too bad I can't get credit for most of my certs though, I bet that would be a computer sci degree entirely on those.

[IrishJohn]

This is interesting, I would have thought that more students at the Big 3 would be largely "testing out" of their degrees. I myself though came in with some college courses and took 1 at TESC, but "tested out" of the rest. Pity that more people don't know of this option. Lord knows it was an eye-opener to me when I discovered IC back in 2009. I only wish I had learned of it sooner!

UPDATE: Here are some students I wish would learn more about the Big 3 and IC...

"Each showed the ability to do college work, even excel at it. But the need to earn money brought one set of strains, campus alienation brought others, and ties to boyfriends not in school added complications. With little guidance from family or school officials, college became a leap that they braved without a safety net.

The story of their lost footing is also the story of something larger — the growing role that education plays in preserving class divisions. Poor students have long trailed affluent peers in school performance, but from grade-school tests to college completion, the gaps are growing. With school success and earning prospects ever more entwined, the consequences carry far: education, a force meant to erode class barriers, appears to be fortifying them."
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/23/educat...=all&_r=1&

[cookderosa]

My husband (now a big shot university chef-instructor lol) and I attended a small college party this past weekend. One of his co-workers JUST finished his MA in Liberal Arts from the University of North Carolina. This co-worker was also a chef, so I asked him why he earned his masters in liberal arts. (you can already tell I'm fishing lol) He explained that he had also earned his BA in liberal arts, and only his associate degree was in culinary. So NOW I'm really interested, because this has CLEP testing and big three written all over it- I'm getting ready for him to tell me all about CLEP....after all, this was/is exactly the path I took. Nope. All classes, most face to face, a few online, but he said he'd taken one CLEP (English Comp) and it was the WORST EXPERIENCE OF HIS LIFE, he'd never EVER take a CLEP again, and wouldn't suggest them to ANYONE! I mentioned the tuition savings (both degrees were from state universities, no not hugely expensive- but still) and he said he'd rather pay the loans than take the exams. <shrug> He isn't a stupid man. He just graduated with a master's degree! I think we (IC forum) live in a forum that isn't really reflective of the edu-world and so sometimes I'll have conversations like that one and it just reminds me of how my world is in a 'hole nuther place.