(Unaccredited) (Mostly) Free Master of Ministry in Pastoral Leadership

[Stonybeach]

Are these ChatGPT responses?

Funny, that actually crossed my mind.

[sanantone]

I also think it's important to know that, in the United States, there's really no such thing as a "recognized faith group." All religious groups have the same rights, including the Satanic Temple, which is an atheist group that mocks religion. If you want to be a chaplain with the DoD or VA, then you'll need an endorsement from a "recognized faith group," but becoming recognized is just a matter of applying and getting accepted as a legitimate religion or denomination of a religion. The Unitarian Universalist Church is recognized even though it is non-creedal. The VA and DoD also recognize endorsement organizations that endorse for independent congregations and non-denominational chaplains. The Order of Universal Interfaith was recognized by the VA even though they ordain and endorse people of all faiths, including no faith. Humanists have not been accepted by the DoD since they have no spiritual beliefs, but on the other hand, they've been recognized by the biggest chaplaincy organizations as a legitimate faith group.

Some organizations have made exceptions to their educational requirements for Buddhists. While a few Buddhist seminaries have popped up to deal with the Christian-centric and discriminatory MDiv requirements of some employers and certification boards, Buddhism does not require their clergy to have a degree.

[Stonybeach]

This is not a good look if you are trying to downplay unaccredited faith-based degrees

If this was directed to me, I don't downplay unaccredited nor endorse accredited religious degrees. If someone teaches with "the spirit," I simply listen.

I love the Golden Tongue rule I learned while traveling to Ghana, Africa. Paraphrased, there are many tongues, from the child to the elderly, and sometimes, the words spoken are "golden" and can help me in my journey through life.

[newdegree]

This is not a good look if you are trying to downplay unaccredited faith-based degrees

If this was directed to me, I don't downplay unaccredited nor endorse accredited religious degrees. If someone teaches with "the spirit," I simply listen.

I love the Golden Tongue rule I learned while traveling to Ghana, Africa. Paraphrased, there are many tongues, from the child to the elderly, and sometimes, the words spoken are "golden" and can help me in my journey through life.

Not directed towards you. The message was for Michael, you might want to read it again.

[michaeladsmith2]

I guess Michael falls into the same category because he is going after an unaccredited degree. "Dr. Smith holds a Bachelor of Business Administration, an MBA & Masters of Business and Corporate Communications from Universidad Isabel I, Barcelona, Spain, and is currently pursuing an additional Master of Theology (ThM) & Doctor of Psychology (PsyD) from the American International Theism University."

https://www.blackleadersworldwide.com/po...GrzpX4wYKg

Also on his website, it claims he has a PhD from an unaccredited school, Ph.D. in Management ©- Swiss School of Business Research Zurich, Switzerland
https://phoenix-risk-management-consulti...t-dr-smith

This is not a good look if you are trying to downplay unaccredited faith-based degrees

I’d like to clarify that both AITU and SSBR hold British accreditation, with ASIC and the British Council being recognized authorities in this area. Although I have decided not to attend those schools as I originally intended, I won’t waste time defending my chosen academic path. Everyone is entitled to their opinions on this matter, and it’s futile to argue with those who are unlikely to change their minds.

[Stonybeach]

Any word on the TRACS accreditation review for VUL? I hope they pull through. I noticed your website said you are a DHA candidate.

[newdegree]

I guess Michael falls into the same category because he is going after an unaccredited degree. "Dr. Smith holds a Bachelor of Business Administration, an MBA & Masters of Business and Corporate Communications from Universidad Isabel I, Barcelona, Spain, and is currently pursuing an additional Master of Theology (ThM) & Doctor of Psychology (PsyD) from the American International Theism University."

https://www.blackleadersworldwide.com/po...GrzpX4wYKg

Also on his website, it claims he has a PhD from an unaccredited school, Ph.D. in Management ©- Swiss School of Business Research Zurich, Switzerland
https://phoenix-risk-management-consulti...t-dr-smith

This is not a good look if you are trying to downplay unaccredited faith-based degrees

I’d like to clarify that both AITU and SSBR hold British accreditation, with ASIC and the British Council being recognized authorities in this area. Although I have decided not to attend those schools as I originally intended, I won’t waste time defending my chosen academic path. Everyone is entitled to their opinions on this matter, and it’s futile to argue with those who are unlikely to change their minds.

Oh, give me a break. We know both schools have been declared degree mills all over the forums. Maybe you should update your website and article if that's not true. Also, don't claim to have a Ph.D. or a candidate for one if you are working towards a legit one.

[sanantone]

ASIC is a hotly-debated topic at Degreeinfo. Some see it as more of a quality control organization. Like most countries, the UK government directly recognizes institutions of higher education and gives them the authority to grant degrees. Unrecognized institutions seek ASIC "accreditation" so that foreign students can receive student visas.

Ironically, ASIC "accreditation" is equivalent to USA state licensing, which basically means that the institution has the legal right to operate. UK degree-granting authority is on par with USA institutional accreditation.

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I, personally, would not put the effort into earning a doctorate at an unaccredited seminary, but that's my choice. I am not quite understanding where Dr. Smith is coming from because he was able to become an ordained minister, associate pastor, and volunteer chaplain without a master of divinity or any theology degree.

Interestingly, Dr. Smith says that he's an ACT therapist/coach who helps people achieve mental wellness. In my opinion, someone with no legitimate mental health credentials should refer to themselves as a therapist, but if your state law allows it, there's nothing I can do. Unlike theology, mental health treatment is a highly-regulated field and should be.

[Kal Di]

When it comes to accrediting secular professions, there is a need for accreditation standards to protect the public, but society cannot demand those same standards for religious organizations. We don't live in a theocracy, and history has proven how dangerous theocratic governments are! My point is that just because something is accredited does not make it legitimate, and just because it is not accredited does not make it illegitimate.

I agree! Also, the ROI of a nationally / regionally accredited religious degree is quite low. The expensive cost of the degree and the career's low and/or stagnant salary often doesn't justify the financial investment of a nationally / regionally accredited religious degree.

While there are a few affordable universities or seminaries (i.e. Nations, Bridges, etc.) with that accreditation, their degree offerings are limited. Unfortunately, some people may have to wait years before they can find a desirable degree program with government accreditation. Otherwise, they sacrifice some of their happiness by enrolling in an existing degree program that does not adequately satisfy their academic and professional desires.

While I prefer universities with accreditation, I don't think they are always better than ones without accreditation. Independent accreditation is better than no accreditation. While government accreditation is ideal, it doesn't ensure the greatest ROI from that religious degree due to unstable demand in the local job market, low and/or stagnant salaries, and the total tuition cost. Furthermore, since the salaries of most religious professionals often depend on congregants' donations, government grants, and/or private foundations, they're among the most vulnerable to economic recessions. Those who work at popular religious schools may be less vulnerable, but it's uncertain whether they'll remain financially sustainable among the growing competition.

Regarding one's accreditation, the prospective employer will be always be the one to determine if an applicant's degree is sufficient for their needs. The prospective employer may request transcripts, view the school's accreditation, online reputation, and/or the degree's curriculum. If the prospective employer is a government organization, then a degree from a school with regional or national accreditation is usually required. Conversely, if the prospective employer is a non-government organization, then a degree from a school with independent accreditation (or none at all) may be adequate for that organization's needs.

Ultimately, I believe the best affordable religious colleges / universities / seminaries have a positive online reputation (from user reviews via social media and/or third party review sites like TrustPilot), a comprehensive degree curriculum, a religious exemption from the state and/or third party accreditation (not limited to USDOE or CHEA accrediting organizations), and a total cost less than $5,000 USD.

[sanantone]

I disagree. Being open about utilizing a religious exemption from accreditation requirements is better than being deceptive by claiming accreditation from a useless accreditation mill. It's really not that much more expensive to become accredited by a national accreditation body than an unrecognized, questionable accreditor that no one is holding accountable. So, I'm suspicious of any school that is paying thousands of dollars to earn accreditation from an organization that's not recognized by USDE or CHEA. It's deceptive marketing.

There are some seminaries that are free, but the scholarships are mostly for on-campus students. What's rather common is that a person will express interest in becoming ordained to their church or the governing board of their denomination, and the church will pay for their education. If you’re already ordained, several seminaries offer 50% discounts.

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You don't need a wide variety of offerings to become ordained. All you need is the MDiv; some denominations require less. A PhD, DMin, ThM, or ThD is unnecessary if your goal is to only become a pastor. Therefore, the MDiv programs at Nations and Bridges are just fine, as long as your church accepts the accreditation, denomination affiliation, and curriculum.

If you want to become a professor, you should definitely pay attention to accreditation unless you're fine with being limited to unaccredited seminaries.