Stupid Policy at a Police Department

[sanantone]

I live in Bexar County, and the Sheriff's Office has this stupid policy of not giving education incentive pay for "internet degrees." Whenever I hear someone say "internet degree," I think of someone who can barely use a computer. They also won't accept degrees from institutions without physical campuses. Considering that they are obviously computer illiterate and uninformed about the current state of higher education, I doubt they can accurately determine whether a degree was earned through the internet. They can't just assume that a degree from University of Phoenix was earned online because they have physical campuses. They also can't assume that a master's degree from Texas A&M was earned on campus. In most cases, the transcripts and diplomas for online degrees are exactly like those of their campus counterparts, so the Sheriff's Office would have to ask someone if a degree was earned online if they can even think to ask. This is where this policy really gets stupid. Bexar County, probably without knowing it, is saying that they will pay you more for a degree from schools like University of Phoenix, Kaplan, Devry, and Strayer; but, they will not pay you more for an "internet degree" from Cornell, Stanford, Harvard Extension, Carnegie Mellon, University of North Carolina, George Washington University, or any of the University of Texas, Texas A&M, Texas Tech, Texas State, or University of Houston campuses. Without knowing it, they could also be paying someone extra for an associate's degree from the Alamo Community Colleges that was earned online. There is absolutely no way they can tell since those colleges are local.

Qualifying degrees must be from a college or university accredited by one of the six (6)
nationally recognized regional accreditation boards. Internet degrees, degrees from institutions
without physical campuses, degrees from diploma mills, or similar institutions shall not qualify

On page 25.
http://www.dsabc.org/docs/contracts/2012...heriff.pdf

[Chebasaz]

Don't come down too hard on them. It seems to be more of a case of bad wording than malicious stupidity. If you pulled the "Internet degree" out of there, it wouldn't be much different than any other place that requires a regionally accredited degree. I agree that the "physical campus" is a bit of a stretch, but how many regionally accredited institutions fall into that category?

I'm not saying that the policy shouldn't be changed. It was obviously written by someone who has very little idea of the options available to students today. That being said, it probably shouldn't reflect the quality of the sheriff's office... merely one of their policy writers.

What I find more interesting is that they require a regionally accredited degree. Many police departments, to include many state police departments, will accept degrees from nationally accredited institutions, on the basis that if it's good enough for the US Department of Education, then it's good enough for them as well.

[sanantone]

I know that not many RA schools fall into the 100% virtual category, but it does include Charter Oak, Excelsior, WGU, and APUS. The "internet degree" is what bothers me the most. Trust me, there are a lot of stupid people in that sheriff's department. The detention officers make the news a lot for doing stupid, criminal, and disturbing things. Almost all of the law enforcement officers have to start out in detention.

Texas is a bit different when it comes to accreditation. The law enforcement licensing agency in this state, TCLEOSE, will not give credit for education received at non-RA schools. I saw one police department that pays an incentive for NA degrees, but you can't use an NA degree to meet the hiring requirements.

Edit: Oh, and this is a collective bargaining agreement, so the whole sheriff's department voted on this.

[GoodYellowDogs]

I think the person who wrote the policy doesn't have a degree. Internet or otherwise.

[cookderosa]

I believe you could argue that all accredited college degrees are not "internet degrees" because "the internet" does not have legal authority to issue degrees in any state. Only a college can issue a degree, so if I earned my degree from a college, then I would expect the pay increase because I would have an accredited college degree. Now, if they didn't understand the distinction, my lawyer could probably explain it using small words.

EDIT: I wanted to copy / paste the part of the policy being referenced-

Qualifying degrees must be from a college or university accredited by one of the six (6)
nationally recognized regional accreditation boards. Internet degrees, degrees from institutions
without physical campuses, degrees from diploma mills, or similar institutions shall not qualify.

I read this as sentence 1 explains the qualifying degree criteria, and sentence 2 explains the type of degree that does not qualify. So, again, I think any RA college with a physical campus wouldn't be questioned (TESC). RA colleges without a physical campus (APUS) would require a fight.

[ShotoJuku]

Qualifying degrees must be from a college or university accredited by one of the six (6)
nationally recognized regional accreditation boards. Internet degrees, degrees from institutions
without physical campuses, degrees from diploma mills, or similar institutions shall not qualify

Sounds like they are referring to PO Box campuses.

[sanantone]

I believe you could argue that all accredited college degrees are not "internet degrees" because "the internet" does not have legal authority to issue degrees in any state. Only a college can issue a degree, so if I earned my degree from a college, then I would expect the pay increase because I would have an accredited college degree. Now, if they didn't understand the distinction, my lawyer could probably explain it using small words.

EDIT: I wanted to copy / paste the part of the policy being referenced-

Qualifying degrees must be from a college or university accredited by one of the six (6)
nationally recognized regional accreditation boards. Internet degrees, degrees from institutions
without physical campuses, degrees from diploma mills, or similar institutions shall not qualify.

I read this as sentence 1 explains the qualifying degree criteria, and sentence 2 explains the type of degree that does not qualify. So, again, I think any RA college with a physical campus wouldn't be questioned (TESC). RA colleges without a physical campus (APUS) would require a fight.

A TESC degree probably wouldn't be questioned because they don't know what they're talking about. All they will see is that TESC offers courses on ground, but they probably won't realize that only the nursing program is on ground. But then again, they will probably wonder how you worked in Texas while attending a school in New Jersey. If you have a degree from Excelsior or Charter Oak, sorry. Your degree is not good enough for them.

My guess is that most of the detention and law enforcement officers do not have a 4-year degree or higher. Someone else on the other forum pointed out their extremely low cap on how many people will receive educational incentive pay: 20 masters and 125 bachelors. I'm just assuming that the union agreed to this low cap because degrees are rare at BCSO. There are about 800 detention officers and probably around 800-1000 police officers. I have to distinguish between the two because they're all called deputies.

As I said on the other forum, University of the Incarnate Word, Our Lady of the Lake University, and St. Mary's University in San Antonio offer "internet degrees." How do they expect to tell that someone attended one of those colleges online? What I also said on the other forum is that I should send an email to Governor Rick Perry's office to tell them that his beloved WGU-Texas is not good enough for BCSO.

[sanantone]

If I had an interest in applying for the Bexar County Sheriff's Office, I would let them go ahead and believe that I earned my degree on ground at Angelo State University. I've already had employers and professors assume that I attended on campus. If they decided to sue me later after somehow finding out I attended online, I'm not sure they would have a case. I don't have any "internet degrees." There is no such thing as an internet degree. Other than Lee University, I have never heard an accredited school refer to one of their programs as an internet program. I've heard correspondence, online, distance, and blended/hybrid. They probably didn't even think about correspondence courses and telecourses.

[publius2k4]

I would be completely willing to fight this fight, if the legitimacy of my degree were under question.

I wonder how a graduate from WGU-Texas would feel knowing that their degree is deemed worthless by this agency....

[cookderosa]

A TESC degree probably wouldn't be questioned because they don't know what they're talking about. All they will see is that TESC offers courses on ground, but they probably won't realize that only the nursing program is on ground. But then again, they will probably wonder how you worked in Texas while attending a school in New Jersey. If you have a degree from Excelsior or Charter Oak, sorry. Your degree is not good enough for them.

My guess is that most of the detention and law enforcement officers do not have a 4-year degree or higher. Someone else on the other forum pointed out their extremely low cap on how many people will receive educational incentive pay: 20 masters and 125 bachelors. I'm just assuming that the union agreed to this low cap because degrees are rare at BCSO. There are about 800 detention officers and probably around 800-1000 police officers. I have to distinguish between the two because they're all called deputies.

As I said on the other forum, University of the Incarnate Word, Our Lady of the Lake University, and St. Mary's University in San Antonio offer "internet degrees." How do they expect to tell that someone attended one of those colleges online? What I also said on the other forum is that I should send an email to Governor Rick Perry's office to tell them that his beloved WGU-Texas is not good enough for BCSO.

Also, I'd like to know what portion of your degree can be completed online before the scales tip into it being an online degree? For instance, if you attend the local community college, you still have the option of mixing it up to fit your schedule. As you pointed out, the transcript doesn't specify, so if you reveal that you took online classes, how many are allowed? 1? half the degree? What if you took all your classes online through your local physical campus RA CC? What if you attended Harvard? That's a no-go too? You have to GO there for most of the degree, but you can do part of it online, so what's the breakdown?