PhD IT, $383 PCH, Bachelors entry, thoughts!?

[bluebooger]

My only curiosity is what sort of criteria they use when awarding this degree. A PhD is research-based and only granted to the student if he/she contributes a significant and new piece of knowledge to the field.

What in IT would require doctoral-level research to contribute a significant and new piece of knowledge to the field?

https://scholarworks.umass.edu/cs_diss/

[armstrongsubero]

My only curiosity is what sort of criteria they use when awarding this degree. A PhD is research-based and only granted to the student if he/she contributes a significant and new piece of knowledge to the field.

What in IT would require doctoral-level research to contribute a significant and new piece of knowledge to the field?

https://scholarworks.umass.edu/cs_diss/

[verenaf]

@louisr you are wrong, IS is NOT Data science.

Data Science vs Information Science.Data science and information science are distinct but complimentary disciplines. Data science is heavy on computer science and mathematics. ...Information science is used in areas such as knowledge management, datamanagement and interaction design.

The IS concentration at ULAR is more IT managment focused. The IQ track is also more IT managment focused though emphasis is on quality.

i am not sure what anyone else is reading but when i look at the classes, i see the same classes as any other data sci program:

data mining
network analysis
social computing/analysis
visualization
systems analysis and design
data science and technologies

i am not an it mgmt person so i have no idea what that study would entail but when i see classes that involve a lot of
technical labwork/coursework i dont think 'management'

worst case scenario, it could be considered more 'applied data science' vs a mathematically rigorous variant, but there
are also 'applied math' and 'applied cs' programs.....

and it still leaves a wide range of research areas....

[armstrongsubero]

@verenaf I dont know what your background is, but here are some things I know.

Computer Science is NOT programming.
Information Techology is NOT computer science.
Engineering Technology is NOT engineering.
Information Science is NOT Data Science.

These are all differnt fields people tend to confuse for some reason.
By your logic if my IT program and CS program both have Database Management and Operating Systems they are the same program?

Please dont confise disciplines like that.

---

BTW as a point of reference engineering technology is applied engineering. That dosent mean they are the same.

[verenaf]

@verenaf I dont know what your background is, but here are some things I know.

Computer Science is NOT programming.
Information Techology is NOT computer science.
Engineering Technology is NOT engineering.
Information Science is NOT Data Science.

These are all differnt fields people tend to confuse for some reason.
By your logic if my IT program and CS program both have Database Management and Operating Systems they are the same program?

Please dont confise disciplines like that.

---

BTW as a point of reference engineering technology is applied engineering. That dosent mean they are the same.

i am not speaking on the equivalency of the terms at all, im simply speaking to the notion that this particular degree can be dismissed as 'it management' when the majority , if not all of the courses use and teach technical skills. its fine to not like a program but to dismiss it so derogatively without merit is a whole other thing.


so there's no 'logic' to apply to any other extreme case.

---

as to why people may 'confuse' terms, its the industry, which to some matters way more than what's printed on any paper.

there are people who are data scientists by position that work all day in excel running prebuilt models

and analysts by title who develop models

programmers who do more analysis than analysts and more data science than data scientists

programmers who do less programming than someone at ...

helpdesk who has to do scripts because they do just as much as

network admins in other places who just reset passwords

"it people" who do more programming than anyone

you get the idea....

in the industry, all of these titles are thrown around randomly. years ago they all would require a "comp sci" degree even though traditional "comp sci" didnt teach half of what would have been needed to be successful. this is a big reason for the rise of certs in the late 90s/early 00s.

and thusly a wider variance of what is covered in some of these programs....and a wider variety of names for them.

comp sci programs in a lot of schools have become a looser variant of traditional math-based computer science to reach a wider audience, to teach more skills that will be of wider practical use, and so on. a "comp sci" program at 4 diff schools is likely to be completely different.

if you're a purist, there are schools out there for you. if you want practical skills, there are schools out there for you.

i have looked at a lot of programs and for my next degree, i want interesting classes that make way to interesting research opportunities. i really don't care what the name is.

i have a b & m masters in CS.....but i did it for the prefix, not because i want to walk around better than anyone.

there is a bubble in which all that other stuff matters.....outside of it, nobody cares.

[ThatBankDude]

@verenaf I dont know what your background is, but here are some things I know.

Computer Science is NOT programming.
Information Techology is NOT computer science.
Engineering Technology is NOT engineering.
Information Science is NOT Data Science.

These are all differnt fields people tend to confuse for some reason.
By your logic if my IT program and CS program both have Database Management and Operating Systems they are the same program?

Please dont confise disciplines like that.

---

BTW as a point of reference engineering technology is applied engineering. That dosent mean they are the same.

A friend of mine got his MS in Computer Science at the University of Oklahoma and is currently working on his PhD in Computer Science at the University of Colorado. While computer science is certainly not programming, I will venture to say that quite a few of those with an education in computer science can program a little bit. He was a software developer for Paycom for a little bit with his CS education. ??‍♂️

[armstrongsubero]

@verenaf I dont know what your background is, but here are some things I know.

Computer Science is NOT programming.
Information Techology is NOT computer science.
Engineering Technology is NOT engineering.
Information Science is NOT Data Science.

These are all differnt fields people tend to confuse for some reason.
By your logic if my IT program and CS program both have Database Management and Operating Systems they are the same program?

Please dont confise disciplines like that.

---

BTW as a point of reference engineering technology is applied engineering. That dosent mean they are the same.

i am not speaking on the equivalency of the terms at all, im simply speaking to the notion that this particular degree can be dismissed as 'it management' when the majority , if not all of the courses use and teach technical skills. its fine to not like a program but to dismiss it so derogatively without merit is a whole other thing.


so there's no 'logic' to apply to any other extreme case.

---

as to why people may 'confuse' terms, its the industry, which to some matters way more than what's printed on any paper.

there are people who are data scientists by position that work all day in excel running prebuilt models

and analysts by title who develop models

programmers who do more analysis than analysts and more data science than data scientists

programmers who do less programming than someone at ...

helpdesk who has to do scripts because they do just as much as

network admins in other places who just reset passwords

"it people" who do more programming than anyone

you get the idea....

in the industry, all of these titles are thrown around randomly. years ago they all would require a "comp sci" degree even though traditional "comp sci" didnt teach half of what would have been needed to be successful. this is a big reason for the rise of certs in the late 90s/early 00s.

and thusly a wider variance of what is covered in some of these programs....and a wider variety of names for them.

comp sci programs in a lot of schools have become a looser variant of traditional math-based computer science to reach a wider audience, to teach more skills that will be of wider practical use, and so on. a "comp sci" program at 4 diff schools is likely to be completely different.

if you're a purist, there are schools out there for you. if you want practical skills, there are schools out there for you.

i have looked at a lot of programs and for my next degree, i want interesting classes that make way to interesting research opportunities. i really don't care what the name is.

i have a b & m masters in CS.....but i did it for the prefix, not because i want to walk around better than anyone.

there is a bubble in which all that other stuff matters.....outside of it, nobody cares.

All this is nice and all unfortunately that bubble is in academia which this forum is based around, soooo I'm failing to see your point.

If I want to get into a masters in EE which was my goal. You need a degree in engineering or computer science. Not IT, not engineering tech, not IS, MIS or anything like that and its stated explictly on the admissions page.

Some MS in CS wont take you without a degree in CS or engineering. Not IT, MIS, IS etc

A CS degree at uni isnt meant to be a cert at a trade school. You networking cert from the 80s is useless today, but that CS degree you will list on your CV.

---

@verenaf I dont know what your background is, but here are some things I know.

Computer Science is NOT programming.
Information Techology is NOT computer science.
Engineering Technology is NOT engineering.
Information Science is NOT Data Science.

These are all differnt fields people tend to confuse for some reason.
By your logic if my IT program and CS program both have Database Management and Operating Systems they are the same program?

Please dont confise disciplines like that.

---

BTW as a point of reference engineering technology is applied engineering. That dosent mean they are the same.

A friend of mine got his MS in Computer Science at the University of Oklahoma and is currently working on his PhD in Computer Science at the University of Colorado. While computer science is certainly not programming, I will venture to say that quite a few of those with an education in computer science can program a little bit. He was a software developer for Paycom for a little bit with his CS education. ??‍♂️

You are missing the point so much it's not even funny.

[jsd]

what a pointless thing to aggressively insist on.

[verenaf]

[sanantone]

I don't know why arnstrongsubero is so angry. I'm usually irritable a week before my period.

Yes, there's supposed to be a clear distinction between CS and IT. Some schools blur that distinction, though. However, there is not a clear difference between IT and IS since there's no quietly accepted standard for those programs as there is with CS.