My Ongoing Argument with COSC on CSU Global CBEs

[sanantone]

Or, maybe it's no longer ongoing because I believe they've stopped responding to me.

Me: I heard that you will accept FEMA IS courses even though they don't come from an accredited college, are unproctored, and don't have ACE or NCCRS approval. Will you accept CSU Global CBEs since they come from a regionally accredited college and are proctored exams?

COSC: Unfortunately no, we would not accept CSU Global CBEs because they are considered “nonresident credits” at CSU. Since CSU counts them as such and does not put them on their own transcripts as local credit, we would not accept them as transfer.

Me: Thank you for your response, but why do you accept FEMA credits if they don't even come from a college?

COSC: We award credits for a number of programs that do not come from a university or college, because they have been evaluated for credit either by our institution, an approved credit evaluator like ACE or NCCRS, or another regionally accredited institution whose evaluation we have reviewed and approved. In the case of FEMA, they have been evaluated for credit by Frederick Community College, and we accept their review of the FEMA courses for undergraduate credit. You can find the long list of training programs, credentials, and other courses that our institution has also evaluated for credit on our website. Unfortunately, the CSU-Global CBEs, because they are considered “nonresident credit” by CSU, rather than local undergraduate credit, cannot be accepted for transfer.

Me: FEMAs are not residential credits at a college or university, so I don't see why CSU Global CBEs not being residential credits is a problem. CSU Global considers the CBEs to be the equivalent of their corresponding college courses and award college credit accordingly, so they have been evaluated and approved by a university. Thomas Edison State University also accepts CSU Global CBEs. So, if I send COSC a TESU transcript, my CSU Global CBE credits should be accepted.


Then, they stopped responding to me. I wouldn't have a problem with COSC not accepting CSU Global CBEs if their reasoning for doing so made sense. They accept transcripts directly from FEMA, which is not a college, and award college credits just because FCC has decided that they are worth college credits. Probably the only reason why CSU Global does not count their CBEs as credits earned in residence is because they want to force students to pay more for online courses in order to meet the residency requirement. Regardless, CSU Global still treats the CBEs as equivalents to their online courses. Since TESU accepts CSU Global CBEs, that throws COSC's whole argument out the window. TESU has determined these are worth college credits, so, if COSC wants to be consistent, they would have to accept TESU's evaluations of CSU Global CBEs. COSC could also evaluate these exams themselves. I have no idea why COSC is so adamantly against accepting CSU Global CBEs, but I can always keep my business at TESU or get the CAHIIM-accredited degree I'm looking into for the purposes of joining USPHS one day at WGU.

[Life Long Learning]

I agree with COSC.:patriot:

It is CSU Global's fault not COSC.

Colleges use a "ABOVE THE LINE" and "BELOW THE LINE" credit standard out here also. That is exactly what they call it!

ABOVE THE LINE = Transfer credits
BELOW THE LINE = Institution Resident Creditscheersmate

Example = TECEPÂ Thomas Edison Credit by Exam are "resident" credits at TESU.
Example = FEMA is "BELOW THE LINE" credits at FCC and CCC and are RESIDENT CREDITS. Not sure how GCC does it?

It is a common college standard!

[sanantone]

I agree with COSC.:patriot:

It is CSU Global's fault not COSC.

Colleges use a "ABOVE THE LINE" and "BELOW THE LINE" credit standard out here also. That is exactly what they call it!

ABOVE THE LINE = Transfer credits
BELOW THE LINE = Institution Resident Creditscheersmate

Example = TECEPÂ Thomas Edison Credit by Exam are "resident" credits at TESU. Same with Excelsior College exams at their place.
Example = FEMA is "BELOW THE LINE" credits at FCC and CCC and are RESIDENT CREDITS.

It is a common college standard!

CSU not treating CSU Global CBEs as resident credits is intentional on their part; COSC got that information on their website, not because they actually saw the CSU Global transcript. But, it doesn't matter where CSU puts the credits on their transcript because COSC accepts FEMA transcripts and other non-academic credentials that don't come from a college at all. Most of the credentials that they award college credit for don't come on any kind of transcript. COSC does not require that FEMA credits be put on an FCC transcript, so they are not accepting FEMA credits that are being treated as residence credits at a college. If they're going to accept FEMAs because a college says that they are college-level, then they should also accept CSU Global CBEs because CSU and TESU have determined that they are college-level. They are being inconsistent. If they really cared about how credits are treated on a transcript, then they would require that FEMA credits be put on a college transcript along with all of the other licenses and certifications they award college credits for.

Uexcels (Excelsior exams) are not resident credit; that's why they are designated with an "X" (which is similar to how CSU denotes CSU Global CBEs). COSC accepts them because they have ACE approval. TESU will not accept Uexcels that are not currently ACE-approved probably because they are partially owned by Pearson which is not a college. When TESU didn't know about the name change from ECE to Uexcel, they told someone that they couldn't accept an exam because they couldn't find it on the ACE National Guide. TESU doesn't require ACE or NCCRS approval for CSU Global CBEs because they are solely the product of a regionally accredited college, not owned in conjunction with a testing company.

[davewill]

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[Life Long Learning]

That is why I am applying to all three of the "Big 3" as they are all different and inconsistent is certain areas unique to them. TESU will not accept "below the line" resident courses from community colleges that colleges in my State do if it is listed "below the line" and resident. I have not been 100% evaluated by COSC (waiting on CLEP/DSST Transcript) and Excelsior College (still waiting). I only have what TESC evaluated in my case as they were first.

[SweetSecret]

Or, maybe it's no longer ongoing because I believe they've stopped responding to me.

:roflol:banghead Welcome to my world; if its above their head or pay level... they [staff wherever] prefer to just ignore the question!

Anyhow, I don't see how they could say they won't take the CSU exam credits. I mean, they are credits from a regionally accredited college, and surely they wouldn't be able to give out credits for those exams and still be regionally accredited if the accrediting body didn't think they measured up to being equal to material learned in a course. I'd continue to fight this one if I were you... it sounds to me like an ignorant adviser. How do they even know that CSU doesn't put them on the CSU transcripts? Have you checked that for yourself? Is this a situation where you could actually enroll in CSU, have the credits put on a transcript, and then send them over to COSC? I know you're smart, and you've probably though of all this already, but to me this just seems silly.

That is why I am applying to all three of the "Big 3" as they are all different and inconsistent is certain areas unique to them. TESU will not accept "below the line" resident courses from community colleges that colleges in my State do if it is listed "below the line" and resident. I have not been 100% evaluated by COSC (waiting on CLEP/DSST Transcript) and Excelsior College (still waiting). I only have what TESC evaluated in my case as they were first.

TESU is just odd sometimes. I had a level 111 math course from a community college that I was required to take, that basically taught you how to use your TI-83 calculator (dumb, right?), TESC wouldn't give me credit for it but then left me with an odd number of credits needed like 12.67. It seemed to me like they should have just taken that course for credit and knocked off that .67.

[dfrecore]

You are correct Sanantone, it makes absolutely no sense! They should apply their own rules consistently. If it's taken from a college, and credits are given by that college, then they should be accepted, regardless of how that college treats the credits for their OWN residency requirements. That should not matter in the least. EC puts their UExcel exams on their transcript, but designates them with an X. The only difference is that EC does not have a residency requirement, so their not giving it "residency" status is only because of that reason. In the future if they did something similar to TESU and had an optional residency requirement, and did NOT let UExcel's count towards that, I guess all of those exams would be out at COSC too?

My hubby is signed up to take the CSU Global courses, I'm interested to see how they send the credit to him. Did you get a transcript from CSU-Global for yours? What did it look like?

[dfrecore]

Question about UExcel's - only about 10 nursing exams are ACE-approved - every single other exam is NOT ACE-approved; most expired on ACE in 2014. Are you sure that TESU does not accept any of these UExcels?

[swalke321]

TESU will still accept Excelsior credit by exam. I have taken a few in 2015 and TESU accepted them without any problems. TESU considers them to be transfer equivalent (TE) same as other courses taken at RA colleges. TESU will even preapprove them. Excelsior is starting to change how they schedule and transcript the exams. In November when I requested a transcript from Excelsior I had to request an official transcript as a non-matriculated student instead of the usual exam transcript. Before November I always requested an exam transcript be sent to TESU. (It was still an official transcript from Excelsior, Excelsior referred to it as an exam transcript.) The courses still show on the transcript with the x to show non resident course but TESU doesn't seem to mind, they accepted it the same as any other transcript I have sent, no additional information was needed. The courses were added to my academic eval without any problems or delay. Excelsior is now using a semester based schedule similar to TESU but Excelsior is a bit more flexible with scheduling the exams then TESU. None of my Excelsior exams were sent to TESU using ACE, the transcript was always sent directly from Excelsior to TESU.

[sanantone]

:roflol:banghead Welcome to my world; if its above their head or pay level... they [staff wherever] prefer to just ignore the question!

Anyhow, I don't see how they could say they won't take the CSU exam credits. I mean, they are credits from a regionally accredited college, and surely they wouldn't be able to give out credits for those exams and still be regionally accredited if the accrediting body didn't think they measured up to being equal to material learned in a course. I'd continue to fight this one if I were you... it sounds to me like an ignorant adviser. How do they even know that CSU doesn't put them on the CSU transcripts? Have you checked that for yourself? Is this a situation where you could actually enroll in CSU, have the credits put on a transcript, and then send them over to COSC? I know you're smart, and you've probably though of all this already, but to me this just seems silly.



TESU is just odd sometimes. I had a level 111 math course from a community college that I was required to take, that basically taught you how to use your TI-83 calculator (dumb, right?), TESC wouldn't give me credit for it but then left me with an odd number of credits needed like 12.67. It seemed to me like they should have just taken that course for credit and knocked off that .67.

TESU's advisors will hang up the phone on you if your questions are too difficult, so that's why I try to only email them. :p At least with their business school, you often get an answer from a senior advisor, director, or assistant director. When you call them, you get whoever they just hired and trained for a few hours. A few years ago when I was complaining about an advisor giving me the wrong answer and hanging up the phone on me on the TESC message board, the head of academic advising chastised me for waiting until the last minute not allowing enough time to send an email. He didn't care that one of his employees was rude and misinformed. The only reason why I waited until the last minute was because my academic advisor refused to help me plan my degree weeks earlier during an advisement appointment. He ended up deleting his ridiculous message board responses. Luckily, TESU has gotten better on the advisement end, and the registrar almost always gives good information. Anyway, they're pretty picky about accepting anything that could be considered developmental.

I don't know how to escalate this at COSC. The emails are from the registrar.

You are correct Sanantone, it makes absolutely no sense! They should apply their own rules consistently. If it's taken from a college, and credits are given by that college, then they should be accepted, regardless of how that college treats the credits for their OWN residency requirements. That should not matter in the least. EC puts their UExcel exams on their transcript, but designates them with an X. The only difference is that EC does not have a residency requirement, so their not giving it "residency" status is only because of that reason. In the future if they did something similar to TESU and had an optional residency requirement, and did NOT let UExcel's count towards that, I guess all of those exams would be out at COSC too?

My hubby is signed up to take the CSU Global courses, I'm interested to see how they send the credit to him. Did you get a transcript from CSU-Global for yours? What did it look like?

CSU Global does put the CBEs on the transcript; they just mark them with an "EX" similar to how Excelsior marks Uexcels with an "X." This is what COSC is reading off of their website.

CBEs are considered nonresident credits, and they will apply toward an undergraduate degree at CSU-Global. If you transfer to another institution, that receiving institution may or may not accept your CBE credits, at their discretion.

I would be fine with COSC not accept non-resident credits if they were being consistent and their rationale made sense. Since they evaluate non-academic credentials all the time for college credits, I don't see why they can't do the same for CSU Global CBEs.

The only reason why I'm interested in a health informatics or health information management degree is because they're the easiest and cheapest programs to complete online that meet USPHS requirements. USPHS no longer accepts research social scientists or mental health professionals other than licensed clinical social workers, which I think is weird because LCSWs probably have the least education in treating various mental health and behavioral disorders. Many in the USPHS Corps end up working for the Bureau of Prisons and Indian Health Services, so you would think that they would need psychologists, LMFTs, LPC/LMHCs, and substance abuse counselors. I could apply directly to IHS, but there aren't as many benefits and flexibility.

COSC and WGU both have the required CAHIIM accreditation. CSU Global has a few CBEs that could possibly fit into COSC's program. I'm not paying $363 per credit hour to complete several COSC courses, so WGU is the best option at this point. I just need to earn a qualifying IT certification since I don't have the IT or healthcare experience for admission. Another option is utilizing TESU's partnership with Rutgers. If I have this right, you complete everything but 12 HIM credits through TESU. Of course, TESU will let you transfer in everything else. After that, you transfer to Rutgers to complete the remaining 12 credits, but Rutgers is expensive, and I think you have to do your practicum at one of their contract sites in New Jersey.