Degree planning help for TESU

[ApesTgtStrong]

Hi, I am an international student at TESU. So I was on this forum a little while back asking for help on what school to choose. I found a thread and copied the dual degree plan for BSBA CIS and BA CS, and have been working towards that till recently when I found out that that degree plan is outdated. Only found out after enrolling and talking to an advisor. Would like some input on how I should go about this. 

Your Location: Singapore
Your Age: 22
What kind of degree do you want?: I was hoping to get both a BSBA CIS and BA CS from TESU, but I'm not sure if dual degrees are still possible or not. 
The academic advisor's email to me is "We do not offer double degree option, however, you have an option to focus on two area of study within one degree program, this means, if you are planning to do BA in Computer Science, you can add another discipline as long as it is under the Bachelor of Arts."
Either way, my main focus is a CS degree. 

Current Regional Accredited Credits:
-NIL-
Current ACE, CLEP, or NCCRS Credits:
Already Transferred Total Credits: # 40.75 

KNOWLDG HUMAN CULTRS: Humanities (Complete)

• COM199 Comm for Personal & Team Effec #1.25
  
• COM299 Communicating for Prof Effect #1.25 
  

Add'l AOS Elect 6SH (In Prog)

• MAT199 Engineering Math I #2.50
  
• MAT199 Engineering Math Iia #2.50
  

Computer Science: Programming (complete)

• COS111 Computer Programming #2.50
  

Elective (Complete) (30.75CR)

1. EGM101 Intro to Engineering #3.75
   
2. COP299 Internship Program #10.00
   
3. AVF299 Aircraft Comm & Navi Sys #3.25
   
4. AVF299 Aircraft Power Plants II #3.75
   
5. AVF281 Aircraft Systems #3.75
   
6. GEN299 General Education 2 #1.25
   
7. EGM299 Thermofluids I #2.50
   
8. EGM250 Engineering Materials I #2.50
   

This is what is shown on TESU's credit transferred page. I have another 32.75 credits under "other courses" in TESU's academic evaluation, which I'm guessing doesn't apply to any requirements. 

Besides that, I have taken another 27 credits on Sophia that are not transferred yet. 

1. English Composition I
   
2. English Composition II
   
3. Intro to Sociology
   
4. Intro to Ethics
   
5. Macroeconomics
   
6. US History I
   
7. Ancient Greek Philosophers
   
8. Environmental Science
   
9. Intro to IT
   

Any certifications or military experience?


-NIL-

My plans moving forward is to take the following classes and proceed with a 16CR semester. But the advisor told me that the cap for each semester is 15 credits so I'm not sure if I can still do that. Also, I'm not too sure about how to fulfill my RA credits. 

[Sophia]

1. Public Speaking 
   
2. Intro to Statistics
   

[SDC]

1. CS201: Data Structures & Algorithms
   
2. MAT108: Discrete Mathematics
   
3. CS105: Intro to Operating Systems
   
4. CS306: Computer Architecture
   
5. JAVA Programming
   
6. CS302: Systems Analysis & Design
   
7. CS303: Database Management
   
8. BUS303: Management Information Systems
   
9. ACC102: Intro to Managerial Accounting
   
10. BUS102: Principles of Marketing
    
11. BUS324: Managerial Communication
    
12. BUS308: Globalization & International Management
    

[b][RA Credits Planned] (TESU classes are planned for 16 CR semester. will be adding a random 1cr course to this. Still short of 1 RA class so would like some input on that)  [/b]

1. [TEL Learn] College Algebra
   
2. [TEL Learn] American Government
   
3. [Outlier] Microeconomics
   
4. [Outlier] Calculus 
   
5. [TESU] SOS-110 Critical Information Literacy
   
6. [TESU] CIS-107 Computer Concepts and Applications
   
7. [TESU] LIB-495 Liberal Arts Capstone
   
8. [TESU] CIS-351-OL Software Engineering
   
9. [TESU] BUS421 Business Administration Capstone
   

[b]Apologies if this is confusing or messy, I tried to keep it as legible as possible so hopefully it is fine. I will attach an excel file of my degree plan but it might be just as confusing due to my constant edits. [/b]

[b]TL;DR [/b]

1. Can I still get double degree from TESU, BSBA CIS and BA CS? 
   
2. Can I do 16 CR semester to avoid paying for the waiver? I'm guessing they wouldn't suggest it unless I already have 100 at least. 
   
3. How should I fulfill the RA credits requirement? 
   
4. Is there a way to check how many RA i have on TESU? I know I don't have any RA credits yet, but I can't find anything in their student service that shows  "0/30" or something equivalent. Just curious to know if that is a function or do I just have to know what they count as RA or not.
   

[davewill]

I think you've fallen prey to yet another bad advisor at TESU. Here's the link to their policy:

https://iq3prod1.smartcatalogiq.com/en/C...ees-Policy

First Simultaneous Associate or Baccalaureate Degrees

Students who desire to have two different Thomas Edison State University baccalaureate degrees awarded in the same graduation cycle may do so providing 24 credits are different in the second degree's core/area of study. In addition, all requirements for both degrees must be satisfied.

Students who desire to have two different Thomas Edison State University associate degrees awarded in the same graduation cycle may do so providing 12 credits that are different in the second degree's option. In addition, all requirements for both degrees must be satisfied.

In both cases, the degrees earned must be different degrees, not just a different/additional area of study. For one degree with two areas of study/options, refer to the Two Areas of Study within One Degree policy.

[ApesTgtStrong]

I think you've fallen prey to yet another bad advisor at TESU. Here's the link to their policy:

https://iq3prod1.smartcatalogiq.com/en/C...ees-Policy

First Simultaneous Associate or Baccalaureate Degrees

Students who desire to have two different Thomas Edison State University baccalaureate degrees awarded in the same graduation cycle may do so providing 24 credits are different in the second degree's core/area of study. In addition, all requirements for both degrees must be satisfied.

Students who desire to have two different Thomas Edison State University associate degrees awarded in the same graduation cycle may do so providing 12 credits that are different in the second degree's option. In addition, all requirements for both degrees must be satisfied.

In both cases, the degrees earned must be different degrees, not just a different/additional area of study. For one degree with two areas of study/options, refer to the Two Areas of Study within One Degree policy.

Hi, Thank you for your prompt reply. 

I see, dang the advisor sounded pretty friendly from the email, is that a common occurrence or something? 

Anyhow, if you don't mind me asking, how do I get 2 degrees? Do I just go through the application process and enroll again? Sorry if this is a rudimentary question, I've just not seen any directions on it and welp, the advisor is probably not gonna give me any proper directions.

[rachel83az]

It is, unfortunately, a common problem with TESU. You've got super-friendly advisors that have no idea what they're talking about. They'll sometimes literally pull "policy" from thin air.

If you're already enrolled at TESU, just email advising and ask them to add the 2nd degree to your plan. If they come back with "but you can't have both", respond with something about how you're undecided and you'll figure it out later. They may come back and tell you that you'll have to drop one before graduation. Whatever. You can ignore this.

1. Can I still get double degree from TESU, BSBA CIS and BA CS? 
   
2. Can I do 16 CR semester to avoid paying for the waiver? I'm guessing they wouldn't suggest it unless I already have 100 at least. 
   
3. How should I fulfill the RA credits requirement? 
   
4. Is there a way to check how many RA i have on TESU? I know I don't have any RA credits yet, but I can't find anything in their student service that shows  "0/30" or something equivalent. Just curious to know if that is a function or do I just have to know what they count as RA or not.
   

1. Yup. See above.
   
2. You can. Depending on your schedule, you might want to do the two capstones separately, but you don't have to. It would cost more money to do them separately, but should still be a bit less than paying the waiver.
   
3. Currently, the least expensive ways to get RA or RA equivalent credit for TESU are TECEPs, XAMK, or TEL Learning.
   
4. Once you have RA credit, it'll show up in the "what if?" in OSS. When you check your degree plan, it'll break down where your credits come from (foreign, CC, university, ACE/NCCRS) and it's pretty easy to keep track.
   

[ApesTgtStrong]

It is, unfortunately, a common problem with TESU. You've got super-friendly advisors that have no idea what they're talking about. They'll sometimes literally pull "policy" from thin air.

If you're already enrolled at TESU, just email advising and ask them to add the 2nd degree to your plan. If they come back with "but you can't have both", respond with something about how you're undecided and you'll figure it out later. They may come back and tell you that you'll have to drop one before graduation. Whatever. You can ignore this.

1. Can I still get double degree from TESU, BSBA CIS and BA CS? 
   
2. Can I do 16 CR semester to avoid paying for the waiver? I'm guessing they wouldn't suggest it unless I already have 100 at least. 
   
3. How should I fulfill the RA credits requirement? 
   
4. Is there a way to check how many RA i have on TESU? I know I don't have any RA credits yet, but I can't find anything in their student service that shows  "0/30" or something equivalent. Just curious to know if that is a function or do I just have to know what they count as RA or not.
   

1. Yup. See above.
   
2. You can. Depending on your schedule, you might want to do the two capstones separately, but you don't have to. It would cost more money to do them separately, but should still be a bit less than paying the waiver.
   
3. Currently, the least expensive ways to get RA or RA equivalent credit for TESU are TECEPs, XAMK, or TEL Learning.
   
4. Once you have RA credit, it'll show up in the "what if?" in OSS. When you check your degree plan, it'll break down where your credits come from (foreign, CC, university, ACE/NCCRS) and it's pretty easy to keep track.
   

Hi, Thank you so much for your response. I'll proceed with that  :). 

Regarding TECEPS, I have a question. I saw somewhere that TECEPs do not count towards residency credits unless I am a military personnel. This was actually the biggest change in my original degree plan. I originally planned to do quite a couple of TECEPS as I have a few classes I've already taken (mostly math classes, like calc, discrete math, statistics, and college algebra) that are not recognized when I transferred so I figured I'll just test out of it. But when I emailed the advisor, they said TECEPs don't count towards RA. As you said about their advising, I guess they made a mistake about this too? 

Either ways, Thank you soo much for your time, this is assuring to know. Thank you.

[davewill]

Hi, Thank you so much for your response. I'll proceed with that  . 

Regarding TECEPS, I have a question. I saw somewhere that TECEPs do not count towards residency credits unless I am a military personnel. This was actually the biggest change in my original degree plan. I originally planned to do quite a couple of TECEPS as I have a few classes I've already taken (mostly math classes, like calc, discrete math, statistics, and college algebra) that are not recognized when I transferred so I figured I'll just test out of it. But when I emailed the advisor, they said TECEPs don't count towards RA. As you said about their advising, I guess they made a mistake about this too? 

Either ways, Thank you soo much for your time, this is assuring to know. Thank you.

TECEPs count as RA credits, but they don't count towards residency (except for military). So if they told you that, yes, they made another mistake.

[bjcheung77]

Take a few moments of your day to review posts, threads, and the WIKI for more details to get familiar with what we correspond about here on the forum. RA are courses taken at a college/university, not through alternative methods such as exams or taking ACE recommended for credit courses, you need 30 credits RA total, 90+ can come from ACE providers we recommend.

I noticed you missed the addendum... This is one of a few reasons I tell people to be more informative in their posts and should really follow the template and last post addendum when looking for advice, by providing more details we can help you get to the final educational goal better. Link: https://www.degreeforum.net/mybb/Thread-...Area-works

[rachel83az]

Wow, you've gotten some exceptionally bad advising. They're usually not quite this bad. TECEPs are, indeed, RA credit but are NOT residency credit for anyone except military. Unfortunately, you can't test out of Calculus at TESU (you can take Sophia pretty quickly for the same result, but that's not RA) but you can test out of Algebra and Stats. https://www2.tesu.edu/listalltecep.php

We usually recommend that students do not talk to advising at all, unless it is absolutely necessary. Even then, keep your queries to simple one or two sentence ones. Good: "Please add XYZ degree to my degree plan. Do not remove my current degree from my plan." Bad: "I think I want to complete XYZ degree in addition to ABC degree. What courses will I need? How close am I to completing this degree?" The first request might get you some comments about how you can't do both, blah blah blah. You can generally ignore whatever they say, so long as both degrees wind up on your plan. The second, they have a tendency to just switch you over to XYZ degree, removing ABC degree, and then they'll possibly tell you a bunch of nonsense that doesn't apply to you at all.

It feels like some advisors at TESU have outsourced their jobs to an AI that has no memory of what was typed 3 sentences before.

If you do need real advising, your best bet is to set up an advising appointment with a known good advisor. There are two or three of them, but the only one I can remember off the top of my head is Don Stolz. Mr. Stolz is widely known for knowing what he's talking about. When he doesn't, he's not afraid to say "I don't know, let me look that up." instead of making up nonsense out of thin air.

[davewill]

I can second the advice to absolutely NEVER make more than one request in an email to TESU advising. They will either conflate your multiple requests into one, or they will, seemingly at random, answer only one of them. It also pays to remember they they will always advise you to take courses at TESU. When asking about alternative credit, you pretty much have to limit yourself to the forms, "How does course A from provider B transfer to TESU?" or "WIll course A from provider B fulfill X requirement in my degree program?" They will never volunteer that any alternative credit can be taken, so if you ask what you can take to fulfill X requirement, you will only get a list of TESU courses.