Ontario Academic Credit - OAC

[OE800_85]

Johann, there's no doubt a lot of politics are at play here. I mean, I personally believe FEMA credits aren't college level, but they're accepted, and it's more or less a political thing to encourage Americans to be prepared in case of an emergency. That's more being a citizen than being an academic, in my view. Also, there are hundreds of college/university courses that I think are an absolute joke, and it's laughable one can get credit for them. As I know, there are some football factories that have courses in breathing and walking. Anyways, that's just my opinion and it doesn't really matter. Unfortunately, Canadian credentials have very little clout. TESC wouldn't even accept my composition course, despite the one at my B&M school being much tougher than the TECEPs. In the end, it's a little political.

You have one advantage; Canada's expectations are much higher for French than America. I really recommend you take the CLEP French. My french is extremely rusty and I haven't practiced in years, and I still got enough for 12 credits.

[Johann]

Unfortunately, Canadian credentials have very little clout. TESC wouldn't even accept my composition course...

I know what you mean. Fortunately, OAC English, besides giving me a (very) few credits in the 80s at Niagara College, exempted me from the two compulsory English courses (a.k.a. "Dummy English") otherwise mandatory for all diploma students.

You have one advantage; Canada's expectations are much higher for French than America. I really recommend you take the CLEP French. My french is extremely rusty and I haven't practiced in years, and I still got enough for 12 credits.

This advice, I assume, applies to the OP. I agree the expectations are higher, but -as I see it- French is not well-taught in most Ontario schools. Students here with accurate pronunciation and good grammar are the exception - not the rule. That was true 50 years ago and is true today. There are French-only high schools in several parts of Ontario -- and I've observed that quite a few of their grads, although fluent, write/speak French with much the same low standards as (too) many grads of English schools do in English! It's harder to make spelling mistakes in French than it is in English - but there are plenty of French-schooled HS grads here who do so consistently, without apparent difficulty! I worked in a largely-bilingual office environment for over 20 years -- so I know what the written/spoken standards were!

English-speaking Ontario HS Grads who remember ANY of their French are not numerous. Back in the day, French was taught to high-schoolers only. I thought then that the results might have been better if instruction started in early years. Today, most Ontario schools start French in about Grade 3. Lamentably, the results in general seem no better after 10 years of instruction (!) than they were after 4 years.

French was my favourite subject in High School and I have taken a French Literature course or two in University - a great pleasure. I still write the odd letter in French. I also took German and Latin in High School. I can remember German and Latin pretty well and still read in both, occasionally. Not much call for writing letters in Latin these days, though.

I doubt if I'll ever get 12 (or any) CLEP credits in French (or anything else) because:

(1) I would have to go more than a thousand miles East or West before I could find a place to write CLEPS. Even Toronto, a nearby city of well over 2.5 million people, has NO exam centre for CLEPs.

(2) If I undertake distance study at American schools (who knows - I might) I will not be seeking any CLEP credits.

(3) CLEPS are not recognized at Canadian schools

(4) If I wanted, I suppose I could write CLEPS across the border in the US - an hour's drive - but I don't travel to the US any more. Since 2001, it's not so easy. It's sort of understandable, but that doesn't mean I have to like it. I used to go over for dinner and/or entertainment any time I wanted. Now it's a passport etc. deal. So I haven't gone across in 12 years . I can get everything I need here. Nothing against the US, of course, but it makes sense to spend one's money at home...

Johann

[OE800_85]

I was just remarking on the differences overall in what an American vs Canadian University deems French aptitude. Getting 12 credits on the CLEP French is no indicator of proficiency, it's not a difficult exam. Anyways, I think you've made your own choice about travel to America. I find it shocking that anyone (who has enough money) doesn't have a passport and hasn't even been to other continents. But that's just me, my passion in life is travel. I think there's a bigger question though, Johann. If you're not taking CLEP/DSST exams, what are you doing on this forum? Basically this ENTIRE forum is about credit-by-examination. It seems this doesn't really apply to you in that case.

[Johann]

I find it shocking that anyone (who has enough money) doesn't have a passport and hasn't even been to other continents.

Got a passport! Where did I say I didn't have one? Bin there (other continents) - done that. You're very quick to make adverse judgments on people!

As for showing the passport at the US Border, after so many years, NO - my decision, which is final. Nothing against Americans. Love 'em. :o

If you're not taking CLEP/DSST exams, what are you doing on this forum? Basically this ENTIRE forum is about credit-by-examination. It seems this doesn't really apply to you in that case.

I was INVITED here specifically. By my friend, your Übermoderator - ShotoJuku (Brian) - Lord of the 4000 posts. You're right, though. It turns out there isn't that much I can contribute on a mostly tests-and-Big-3 forum. On other stuff, I'm not bad as an occasional "debunker," though. However, if you don't like my being here at all:

(a) Just ignore me or (b) take it up with ShotoJuku!

Johann

[Jonathan Whatley]

Johann's a great guy who knows his nontraditional higher education, and is very good to have around.

In defense of people from Canada hesitant about plans to just cross the U.S. border – this has come up here before – this can be a production, and sometimes a barrier. Even Canadian citizens need a passport, or a quasi-passport special ID. Many people living in Canada, further, aren't Canadian citizens. Many of these would have to apply to the U.S. State Department for a visa on their passports from a third country. There are also exclusions from entering the U.S. based on criminal record.

[Johann]

...this can be a production, and sometimes a barrier. Even Canadian citizens need a passport, or a quasi-passport special ID.

Yes, Jonathan, and that can, as you say, be problematic. My son told me recently that Ontario's "enhanced" drivers' licence would get him, his wife and kids across the border. He could then drive anywhere in the US, but he could NOT use it to get on a plane in Buffalo NY to take them to Disney World. He and his family CAN, of course, use their passports for that...

Just a minute - maybe they couldn't drive in Florida. In a recent, regrettable move, Florida required Canadians - by far their biggest tourist customers - to obtain International Driving Permits. Reason: so Florida police could read them. I guess Florida officials didn't know most Canadian drivers' licences are in English! However, in what I consider an equally regrettable decision, Quebec decided its drivers' licences would be in French only. I guess that caused the fracas. It's here:

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2013/02/...ermit.html

Apparently, Florida has backed off somewhat re: enforcement -- but a lot of Canadian Snowbirds are still worried.

There are also exclusions from entering the U.S. based on criminal record.

Ah, Jonathan -- you know me all too well. (Kidding) Seriously, my "refusenik" stance on passport production at the US border is my way of rebelling against what I see as new bureaucratic tomfoolery, that I didn't have to put up with for many, many years. My reaction is, I realize, not for everyone. But I still don't like it when folks
(not you, Jonathan ) get judgmental and suggest:

(a) I'm too poor to have a passport,
(b) have nothing to contribute to the forum and
© have never been anywhere.

Nope - didn't like that part one little bit... but I'll let it go, for now.

Johann

[OE800_85]

Johann, I want to apologize. I wrote that post quite quickly and sort of without review. I didn't mean to come off sounding disrespectful. Not my intention, please accept my apology.

[Johann]

Johann...please accept my apology.

Done! We're all good, here!

Johann