BSBA Accounting - Degree Plan for TESC

[keithk]

So I finally got my eval from TESC back!

It was like a 4-week long night before Christmas waiting for that to be completed. Still waiting on the Excelsior eval before I decide which college to go with, but thought I'd try to put together a plan for TESC while I wait. I have a lot of research to do yet on the UL classes before going to an advisor, but curious if anyone noticed any glaring problems with what I have so far? And if you have any recommendations for the "???" spots, I would love the input.

Thanks in advance.

[Yenisei]

For the business electives, consider the HRM DSST, the MIS DSST, the Org Behavior DSST or the Money & Banking DSST.

If I were you, I'd take my UL accounting courses from regionally accredited schools because the vast majority of states will accept them for CPA licensing purposes even if you took them via distance learning, although a few states, e.g., Texas, will insist on butt-in-the-seat courses only. Look at LSU Independent Study and Adams State College, unless you are opting for the military option at TESC, in which case you should take your accounting courses from them.

EDIT: Bus Law II DSST is another business elective that might work.

[LaceyLady]

I agree with Yenisei. I will also add that other options for business electives are DSST Intro to Business and Business Math as well as any other business exams or courses (such as TECEP or ECE options).

I notice that you have US History I and II under Social Sciences, but I thought that two different subject areas were required. If two different subject areas are required, you could move one history to general education electives and take one more social science (government, psychology, sociology, geography, anthropology, or CLEP general social sciences).

Many schools offer accounting courses. Straighterline's Managerial Accounting course (not the same as Accounting II) transfers as UL Cost Accounting. You could look into Penn Foster or LSU for more courses. Alternatively, you could take the courses at TESC and get a GPA.

Everything looks good. Hope this helps.

[ryoder]

If you want to be a CPA, don't you need 30 accounting credits past the bachelors level?
So maybe the license process will not go into the undergrad details and simply look at his masters in accounting.

[Yenisei]

In the vast majority of states you need 30 additional credits, not 30 additional accounting credits. Here are Michigan's educational requirements for CPA licensing: http://www.michigan.gov/documents/dleg/E...1842_7.pdf

It just doesn't seem to make sense to potentially paint yourself into a corner by taking ACE-approved accounting courses with Penn Foster rather RA courses with LSU. Maybe you want to get licensed before getting an MSA, or don't want an MSA at all.

[keithk]

First of all, thank you Yenisei and LaceyLady for the replies and the course recommendations too, that really helps. Lacey, I think Economics fulfills the 2nd dept requirement for social sciences, but I will be sure to confirm that now, thanks.

I was tentatively planning on doing exactly what Mr. Yoder was referring to in using the Masters qualification for the CPA, but Yenisei, you make a really good point. I wasn't thinking about potentially painting myself into a corner if I don't pursue the Masters or if I'm just plain wrong about my assumption that as long as the credits were accepted by an RA school like TESC for my degree, that they would be allowed by the MACPA. I made that assumption from the following info:

ORR Admincode

R 338.5145 Adoption of accreditation standards by reference; board recognition of educational institutions; requirements for concentration in accounting.
Rule 145. (1) For the purpose of identifying the educational institutions that meet the educational standards required by the board to satisfy section 725 of the act, both all of the following provisions apply:
(a) The board adopts the criteria for accreditation of the north central
association of colleges and schools, commission on institutions of higher
education, included in the publication entitled "Handbook of Accreditation,
Third Edition." Accreditation by the north central association of colleges
and schools or an affiliated association is prima facie proof of having met
the criteria.

(2) A concentration in accounting shall include the following accounting
and general business subjects, for which credit is transferable to any
baccalaureate degree-granting institution recognized by the department:
Auditing 3 semester hours Accounting principles 21 semester hours
General business subjects 24 semester hours The accounting principles shall
include study in each of the following areas:
(a) Financial accounting and accounting theory.
(b) Managerial accounting, including cost accounting.
© Accounting systems and controls
(d) United States federal taxation.
(e) Governmental/fund accounting.

My biggest frustration is that I have to assume at all. I can't get anyone on the phone or by e-mail at MACPA to give me an answer about the 30 accounting credits (testing out vs taking the actual classes). They haven't responded to multiple e-mails or voicemail so I (stupidly) was thinking about just going forward with my plan based on my assumptions. Perhaps the person in charge of student relations doesn't want to be on the hook for the wrong answer. This route that we take here seems to often lead to a lot of confusion by those that are used to the cookie-cutter college approach.

Also, another concern is that if they are going to limit the accounting requirements to only RA college classes, they could use that same logic and apply it to the 39 additional credits in the areas below:

http://www.michigan.gov/documents/dleg/E...1842_7.pdf

I. Thirty semester hours of accounting subjects, including not more
than 6 semester hours of taxation. Additional semester hours in
accounting subjects may be applied toward the general business
subject requirements.
II. Thirty-nine additional semester hours with a minimum of 3 semester
hours, but not more than 12 semester hours, in not fewer than 5 of
the following areas:
A. Business law.
B. Economics.
C. Ethics.
D. Finance.
E. Management.
F. Marketing.
G. Taxation.
H. Statistics.
I. Business policy.

I just need to go back to MACPA and if I still can't get an answer from the first contact, I'll start working my way up the ladder until I get a firm answer....admittedly, that's something I should have done already!

[Yenisei]

That's an excellent point about the other business courses, keith; however, you would still have the option of doing an MBA or other undergrad courses to accomodate any RA requirements. That's not as onerous as having to do both accounting courses and business courses to meet the requirements or taking every business requirement as a course- you don't want to take too long to earn the degree since you will also need some accounting experience to get licensed and you do want to contain the cost of your degree, making CLEP and DSST for the general business requirements and RA courses for the accounting requirements a good compromise. Note also that in most states 3 grad credits are worth 4.5 undergrad credits.

I've looked at numerous states' stated CPA educational requirements online, and Michigan's are by far the vaguest I have ever seen. Keep pressing them for a definitive answer- you have the right idea.

In closing, I'd like to clarify something I posted earlier so that there is no possible confusion- no state demands 30 additional accounting credits at the grad level or otherwise; however, almost all demand 150 credits overall, or 30 beyond the bachelor's, and those who do not at this point are transitioning to the 150 credit requirement.

[keithk]

Thanks Yenisei. I figured out that the MACPA was not the right place to be asking my questions, they are just the Association and not the Licensing Division.

I went to the Dept of Licensing and explained that TESC is regionally accredited and they accept CLEP, DSST, Straighterline, Penn Foster, and other non-traditional ACE approved methods for lower and upper level courses, including accounting and business classes, yada yada. They quickly got back to me with some good news:

Hello –

The Department accepts credits from regionally accredited institutions (including CLEP) as long as they are included on the official transcripts. Please let me know if this does not answer your question.

Michigan Department of Licensing & Regulatory Affairs
Bureau of Commercial Services, Licensing Division

I might still end up attending classes for some UL courses, but it's nice to know that it will be ok if I decide to test out or use Straighterline, Penn Foster, etc.

[Yenisei]

Great job, keith, and it's fantastic news that Michigan will accept the ACE-approved and testing options. Many states will not.

[keithk]

Great job, keith, and it's fantastic news that Michigan will accept the ACE-approved and testing options. Many states will not.

Thank you, I was pretty excited about it. Now when it's 10 degrees this February, I can be thankful to be stuck in Michigan

After I thought about it a little more though, I followed up with another e-mail to make sure there was absolutely no question about it. I got this reply, so I'll have to get with TESC and EC to see if they send transcripts for CPA applications with the Accounting and Business courses divided into correct categories:

Where you may run into an issue is for the breakdown. Are you going to have Masters in Acct?? If not and you have to provide the 30/39 breakdown of courses, they will have to be on the transcript from Thomas Edison (or an accredited institution) in order for you to use them. Not all college provide the breakdown of transfer credits. Does this help?

Michigan Department of Licensing & Regulatory Affairs
Bureau of Commercial Services, Licensing Division

I know EC has an Accounting and New York CPA track degree, so I would guess that at least they have some way of doing it, but I'll have to confirm with both colleges.